(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Chinese]SZ[19]HA[7]KM[0.50]TM[2700]
PW[EGC2010]PB[EGC2010Bot]DT[2010-07-28]PC[The KGS Go Server at http://www.gokgs.com/]C[EGC2010Bot [-\]: GTP Engine for EGC2010Bot (black): MoGo version MoGo version 4.86.Soissons: I'll resign if you win and playing until you pass if I win. If you passed and I did not, it often means that the status of some stones are not clear enough for me (I want to be sure we will agree on dead stones). Clarify them. Maybe I am losing, but have not enough time to be sure I should resign. In this case play until the end :'( (very rare cases)
]RE[B+1.50]
;B[dd]BL[2699.617]
;B[dj]BL[2699.394]
;B[dp]BL[2699.188]
;B[pd]BL[2698.974]
;B[pj]BL[2698.761]
;B[pp]BL[2698.551]
;B[jj]BL[2698.329]C[TonyTiger [4d\]: go go go!
]
;W[nq]WL[2691.314]
;B[ql]BL[2687.161]
;W[iq]WL[2675.917]
;B[cq]BL[2675.275]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: it's bot vs bot?
TonyTiger [4d\]: this game is going to be a mess
]
;W[jc]WL[2667.876]
;B[qc]BL[2662.727]
;W[fc]WL[2663.715]C[TonyTiger [4d\]: white is catalin taranu
TonyTiger [4d\]: 5p
]
;B[cg]BL[2649.55]
;W[fq]WL[2654.844]C[dmf [15k?\]: it looks difficult to win
]
;B[fp]BL[2635.68]
;W[gp]WL[2653.2]C[dmf [15k?\]: with so many handicap stones
]
;B[fo]BL[2621.133]
;W[eq]WL[2651.474]C[Whyyyyy: comp dumb
]
;B[go]BL[2605.929]
;W[hp]WL[2649.871]
;B[ho]BL[2590.017]C[funkymunky [3k\]: computers are getting very strong
]
;W[io]WL[2648.526]C[Liisa [2d\]: info for the game:
funkymunky [3k\]: only of matter of time before go is like chess
Liisa [2d\]: http://www.egc2010.fi/news.php
WorldCop [2k\]: hm, not on this size. always mogo goes for frail moyo
]
;B[in]BL[2573.417]
;W[jo]WL[2647.341]C[theripper [1d\]: impossible that go will be like chess
]
;B[jn]BL[2556.164]C[funkymunky [3k\]: very possible
]
;W[kn]WL[2645.081]C[MaxMakinen [2k\]: funkymonkey.. when supercomputers running on hundreads of cores loose against amateurs.. it'll be a while before home computers can beat masters :D
emerus [5k\]: In 9x9 games, it is
funkymunky [3k\]: 5-10 years
]
;B[km]BL[2538.15]C[funkymunky [3k\]: remember the cloud is coming --
KittyLuk [2d\]: so is this man vs cpu?
theripper [1d\]: first of all it's impossible for a computer to calculate the perfect game
requires [2d\]: so hard for w
Jadeite [7k?\]: only a matter of time before an apple will be like a banana
]
;W[cl]WL[2636.863]C[theripper [1d\]: and it will be always impossible
Wagaboo [11k\]: and man will win
funkymunky [3k\]: a home computer can be ==> cloud based supercomputer
MalyJezyk [1d\]: it's also impossible for humans
]
;B[ln]BL[2519.531]
;W[ko]WL[2634.641]C[WorldCop [2k\]: speak for yourself
falloutti [1d?\]: I usually lose against bots, not because they're strong, but because I lose interest in about 20 moves :o
yonasi [4d\]: computers will do that eventually....
Higanbana [?\]: you mean intractable, not impossible
]
;B[lm]BL[2500.252]C[MaxMakinen [2k\]: funkymonkey, we will see, impossible to speculate about such things now when it really doesnt exist yet for home computering
yonasi [4d\]: go isn't an unsolvable puzzle
dmf [15k?\]: i don't like playing against bots.. they play too fast
]
;W[bj]WL[2629.459]C[emerus [5k\]: computer calculates that c8 already dead
emerus [5k\]: lo,l
theripper [1d\]: all ahs been calculated already. You ll not have enough time till the end of the universe to calculate everything
KittyLuk [2d\]: when cpu beat human on go that means the era of IROBOT is here. Face the human extinction
]
;B[cn]BL[2480.276]
;W[bn]WL[2626.404]C[Firons [10k\]: well said
ARPAnet [5k\]: humans themselves are the proof that it is possible to play Go well.
funkymunky [3k\]: computers are already hitting 2d
Whyyyyy: one thing is certain, computers will never have intuition
ARPAnet [5k\]: humans are just machines.
]
;B[bo]BL[2459.66]C[funkymunky [3k\]: on "home" computers (very strong hardware)
Iciac [5k\]: Amateur 2d?
funkymunky [3k\]: yes
MalyJezyk [1d\]: not really, beating 9p is much easier than creating real AI
funkymunky [3k\]: Zenbot 
yonasi [4d\]: and humans can build machines that are smarter than humans
MalyJezyk [1d\]: brute force will work
]
;W[dn]WL[2608.773]C[funkymunky [3k\]: was 2d on kgs.. hit 3d and 4d for few games
WhoKnows [11k\]: the time is absolute lol...
falloutti [1d?\]: intuition is the one thing that gets people into trouble anyways
]
;B[cm]BL[2438.339]
;W[dm]WL[2605.756]C[ARPAnet [5k\]: exactly yonasi, machines like DeepBlue
Higanbana [?\]: was 2d on 19x19 or 13x13?
Whyyyyy: :)
funkymunky [3k\]: 19x19
mareck [11k\]: so B is the bot?
]
;B[bm]BL[2416.279]C[yonasi [4d\]: machines like DeepQA.  you all know a computer is already beating people at Jeopardy?
]
;W[dk]WL[2593.672]C[falloutti [1d?\]: mareck, nicely figured out
funkymunky [3k\]: Zen19 is the username of the bot on KGS 2d
ARPAnet [5k\]: didn't know that.
ARPAnet [5k\]: nice 
]
;B[bl]BL[2393.608]C[yonasi [4d\]: IBM Watson
]
;W[cj]WL[2589.743]C[MrPopCorn [7k\]: long life to the bot !
]
;B[ej]BL[2370.309]
;W[ek]WL[2585.688]C[funkymunky [3k\]: so 5-10 years it is possible
WorldCop [2k\]: i for one welcome...ah nvm
funkymunky [3k\]: chess is even scarier now
kitblitz [1k\]: how many CPU?
vandrei [11k\]: this is Catalin game
funkymunky [3k\]: in the 1960-70s-80s
]
;B[gj]BL[2346.323]C[MrPopCorn [7k\]: but i prefer to watch bot vs human :)
falloutti [1d?\]: I heard this is the 74. ranked supercomputer in the world or something
]
;W[di]WL[2577.898]C[vandrei [11k\]: this is Catalin Taranu game
GregHouse [2d\]: 10000 cpu
vandrei [11k\]: ?
GregHouse [2d\]: something like that
Wagaboo [11k\]: ^^
funkymunky [3k\]: people were saying the same thing... chess is too complex, there is not enough computing power, it would take too long, etc...
]
;B[ei]BL[2321.653]C[MaxMakinen [2k\]: falloutti, yeah, but i don't think they're running on all the cpus
Firons [10k\]: 2012, GG to humans cuz bot has beaten all players. (As predicted) lol
Wagaboo [11k\]: i think that computers with 10 000 cpu are cheaters
]
;W[dh]WL[2574.63]C[falloutti [1d?\]: Max, propably not :D
Wagaboo [11k\]: that's like 10000 persons on a goban
yonasi [4d\]: the processing ability of computers is increasing exponentially...beware
]
;B[ec]BL[2296.317]
;W[fd]WL[2571.293]C[WorldCop [2k\]: hm, not for long probably
Onmyoji [-\]: what is this
funkymunky [3k\]: it was true -- for 30 years, then in 1989 it started to happen
sushisan [4d\]: can 10000 cpu find B12 ?
Footprints [3k\]: a computer can never read all possibilities
Firons [10k\]: One day, bot will try to take over the world by hacking into all com
WorldCop [2k\]: for monte carlo doesn't matter, but cpu's don't get much faster
]
;B[ef]BL[2270.295]C[WorldCop [2k\]: just more
]
;W[bh]WL[2555.473]C[MalyJezyk [1d\]: sure they get much faster
yonasi [4d\]: indeed, more and more exponentially
Whyyyyy: were there 2 exactly the same go games played ever?
sushisan [4d\]: they cant
Kilik [1k\]: lol sushi
funkymunky [3k\]: by 1989 grandmaster level... by 1995 world champion level
WorldCop [2k\]: there is a limit to what parallelization can do
yonasi [4d\]: parallel processing is the future anyhow
pokp: who is playing white?
falloutti [1d?\]: how many possibilities there are on a go board anyway?
WorldCop [2k\]: you need to sync all information
]
;B[hg]BL[2243.588]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: in evolution all races created their supperior race on their own
WorldCop [2k\]: and that is done sequentially always
hatego [3k\]: Catalin Taranu 5p
Footprints [3k\]: there are more possible outcomes than atoms in the universe
yonasi [4d\]: a parallel computer can do anything a human brain can
pokp: thc
FrodosGban [8k?\]: now we will create the next race
funkymunky [3k\]: by 2000s... $50 software on desktop is grandmaster level
Iciac [5k\]: Firons - that would be IdiotBot [30k\]
falloutti [1d?\]: Footprints, yea, right
shikashogi [10k\]: footprints that statement is really bad 
Firons [10k\]: LOL
WorldCop [2k\]: idiotbot is very strong
Footprints [3k\]: its physically not possible to make a computer like that
abacusball [6k\]: computers can do almost nothing :)
Footprints [3k\]: its true
Wagaboo [11k\]: well on a goban there's
]
;W[cf]WL[2520.185]C[WorldCop [2k\]: but i have a fuseki to beat him
funkymunky [3k\]: top level computers, built for chess... elo about 3700
Footprints [3k\]: do your own math :)
sushisan [4d\]: idibot?
nhanh [1d\]: well looks like b will lose badly
shikashogi [10k\]: its not true footprints, do you know the size of the universe?
Whyyyyy: neuron webs would help computer a lot
funkymunky [3k\]: strongest human player in history about 2900 elo
abacusball [6k\]: we are listening to these tales since 60-s
mareck [11k\]: would love it if the bot lost
]
;B[ce]BL[2216.092]C[Opul3nce [?\]: 8 cores did he say?
]
;W[df]WL[2516.824]C[falloutti [1d?\]: 361 moves at first which all lead to their own game, and so on always decreasing by 1, until stones are eaten etc :o
Footprints [3k\]: like i said, you can calculate yourself if you want
Footprints [3k\]: it is true
Wagaboo [11k\]: 361*360*359..... etc possibilities
shikashogi [10k\]: footprints i am a mathematician but im also a physicist
Isobeutel [4k\]: 64x8 cores
Footprints [3k\]: okay
shikashogi [10k\]: do the logic instead, universe - rpretty damn big
pokp: lol that's really stupid to say computers are 3700 elo
Footprints [3k\]: then you know the number of atoms in the universe
]
;B[dg]BL[2188.037]C[Koons [1k\]: w + time :)
]
;W[bf]WL[2513.454]C[KittyLuk [2d\]: unforturnatly I think the bot is losing this one
shikashogi [10k\]: footprints no-one knows the atoms in the universe
Athanor [-\]: 3700 elo doesn't exist. welcome back to reality ^^
pokp: yeah of course
Stoneflow [-\]: the number is too big
Firons [10k\]: W is a player or bot?
Athanor [-\]: 2750 is sort of max, maybe 2800
]
;B[eh]BL[2159.286]C[Footprints [3k\]: well lets say then, observable universe
WorldCop [2k\]: there are good guesses to the number
Wagaboo [11k\]: i think that go bots will elvolve faster in their programmation
MalyJezyk [1d\]: perfect play is estimated at 3500 as far as I remember
WhoKnows [11k\]: w is a players
Footprints [3k\]: if thats a better term
WhoKnows [11k\]: ops
Wagaboo [11k\]: than
Stoneflow [-\]: but itws not infinity
WhoKnows [11k\]: a player
MalyJezyk [1d\]: comps get 3200
Firons [10k\]: O tys
juhop [1d?\]: atoms in the observable universe is thw only thing there's numbers of
kuss: who is playing?
yonasi [4d\]: this heads into the quantum theory debate...
Wagaboo [11k\]: in their number of CPU
FrodosGban [8k?\]: if apes would have known they create the humans they would have tried to kill it
funkymunky [3k\]: (bc they no longer allow bot into tournament play in chess -- so they didnt let them level up)
WhoKnows [11k\]: Catalin taranu it was said.
vogelfrei [2d\]: i play at -10 eloand still win sometimes
]
;W[bg]WL[2486.35]C[st21 [-\]: b ahead
funkymunky [3k\]: theoretically now at 3700 ELO
sushisan [4d\]: computer vs human comparisons are a sure sign of weak intellect
FrodosGban [8k?\]: if we knew we will create our race via bot
abacusball [6k\]: not ong ago computers learned to walk on 2 legs... it was sensational :)
kuss: taranu is black?
FrodosGban [8k?\]: *superior race via bot
un [2k\]: how to make go a nerd game, thx mogobot !
WhoKnows [11k\]: white.
offcolour [7k\]: apes did not create humans
Wagaboo [11k\]: i think that's the programmer against the go player
]
;B[ee]BL[2129.895]C[juhop [1d?\]: the universe probably continues behind the horizon 
YogSothoth [2d\]: please explaint your theori
]
;W[md]WL[2482.804]C[HikaruLowl [5k\]: apes didn't "create" humans
HikaruLowl [5k\]: ;..
kuss: pro vs computer with no handi?!
Onmyoji [-\]: loool
vandrei [11k\]: no catalin is w
YogSothoth [2d\]: theoretical 3700 elo
st21 [-\]: yes taranu black
nhanh [1d\]: how does this championship works?
FrodosGban [8k?\]: evolution will always find its way
Faonig [7k\]: 7 handi
vandrei [11k\]: lol
yonasi [4d\]: this conversation has failed
vandrei [11k\]: Catalin is white
FrodosGban [8k?\]: what could come next after humans
vandrei [11k\]: bot is black
Opul3nce [?\]: #its a super comp so it can use brute force
DaiMaou [1k\]: white almost won
Whyyyyy: Catalin is black
st21 [-\]: bot is w
]
;B[qf]BL[2099.806]C[sushisan [4d\]: hikaru: an Ape did create humans
FrodosGban [8k?\]: nothing made of flesh
Liisa [2d\]: Top computers play in Chess servers around 3200+ Elo rating. But with supercom it might be much higher rating.
Opul3nce [?\]: min max tree ect
Faonig [7k\]: lol
vandrei [11k\]: bot is b
Jadeite [7k?\]: kuss, open your eyes
Whyyyyy: bot is w
vandrei [11k\]: w is catalin
ilfuria [7k\]: will this game be commented later?
Faonig [7k\]: whyyyyy, tg
vandrei [11k\]: w is catalin
Wagaboo [11k\]: bot os black XD
HikaruLowl [5k\]: nope
falloutti [1d?\]: haha
sushisan [4d\]: b == catalin hahahaha
st21 [-\]: catalin is b
nhanh [1d\]: universe in continuous? Dont think so
falloutti [1d?\]: crazy witch doctor monkeys summoned humans
Footprints [3k\]: here you go guys
st21 [-\]: r17 pro move
ARPAnet [5k\]: how strong is this bot?
Footprints [3k\]: http://senseis.xmp.net/?NumberOfPossibleOutcomesOfAGame
vandrei [11k\]: catalin is black
offcolour [7k\]: humans are a branch from the chimp
funkymunky [3k\]: Playing strength versus computer speed  It has been estimated that doubling the computer speed gains approximately fifty to seventy Elo points in playing strength (Levy & Newborn 1991:192).
Footprints [3k\]: scroll under
Onmyoji [-\]: 7 handicap
Athanor [-\]: this bot fails big time
Onmyoji [-\]: lolol
Koons [1k\]: commented, ilfuria, maybe b will explain his moves?  :)
nhanh [1d\]: continuity is man's creation
sushisan [4d\]: b doing very well for a human
Jadeite [7k?\]: 3500 BC they had vehicles with engine management that ran on bio fuel
Wagaboo [11k\]: black named EGC2010Bot
dmf [15k?\]: stop confusing people, read the names... catalin is white
vandrei [11k\]: bot is black
st21 [-\]: bot strong enough for give Taranu 7 stone handy
Wagaboo [11k\]: there is bot in the name
]
;W[pi]WL[2426.755]C[vandrei [11k\]: catalin white
betise [1d\]: black kept much of his handicap advantage until now
vandrei [11k\]: bot black
ARPAnet [5k\]: thanks sushisan
Onmyoji [-\]: =))))))))))))))))))))))999
Stoneflow [-\]: how big is the number of variations, i mean there has to be a number
Jye [15k\]: footprints: the number of atoms in the universe doesn't equal the number of possibilities a computer can represent
yosogo [1d\]: this bot is strong
sushisan [4d\]: anytime
petermeter [17k?\]: dont be racist, just because the bot plays black, he still might noch be^^
Iciac [5k\]: Bot has a computer beside his name.
Wagaboo [11k\]: Stoneflow
petermeter [17k?\]: not*
]
;B[qj]BL[2069.039]C[pokp: 3700 elo would be impossible to beat even 1 game out of 100 for a pro chess player
pokp: so stop saying crap
]
;W[pg]WL[2415.113]C[funkymunky [3k\]: that is the case
Opul3nce [?\]: why not hane?
Whyyyyy: chess is for woleys
Wagaboo [11k\]: on a goban there is 361*360*359 etcc....
funkymunky [3k\]: humans cannot beat computers anymore
WorldCop [2k\]: pro players can't beat supercomputers anymore
Wagaboo [11k\]: variations
MalyJezyk [1d\]: it's not funkymunky
FrodosGban [8k?\]: whatever if we would know we will have a superior race we would kill it so evolution has it that we underestimate everything
nhanh [1d\]: i think b already lost
pokp: that is not the case
Wagaboo [11k\]: about
Stoneflow [-\]: i know
shikashogi [10k\]: wagaboo its much easier to say 361!
MalyJezyk [1d\]: humans still beat comps at chess ocasionally
funkymunky [3k\]: last tourment was 9.5 - to .5 
Stoneflow [-\]: but the number
funkymunky [3k\]: so human could only get 1 draw
fatihsulak [-\]: b still has tons of territory
]
;B[pf]BL[2037.638]
;W[ng]WL[2412.819]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: chess and go is different
HikaruLowl [5k\]: wagaboo, it's wrong
pokp: sometimes pro players win a game, may be not the match but a game
Orandajinn [2d?\]: hi
shikashogi [10k\]: but thats mathematical notation, 361 factoral is english
HikaruLowl [5k\]: because of symetry
Wagaboo [11k\]: about
Athanor [-\]: considering that pros can't reach 2n8k elo, no one can defeat 3700. ever. That makes their existence hard to demonstrate...
pokp: so that's really stupid
Opul3nce [?\]: chess and go are different......no really.. I would never have guessed
yosogo [1d\]: why human use les time
PtitLudo [3d\]: no threre is less var
]
;B[qq]BL[2005.504]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: I forgot symmetry U're right T___T
sushisan [4d\]: game not lost yet, but b lost large part of 7 stone advantage
]
;W[no]WL[2402.128]C[nhanh [1d\]: ok R3 makes it interesting again
funkymunky [3k\]: they can go back in history
Koons [1k\]: bot really likes 4-4 then 3-3
funkymunky [3k\]: play against all the top grandmaster
Opul3nce [?\]: when b play b15 
FrodosGban [8k?\]: chess and go both have possibilities but chess has defined figures
Onmyoji [-\]: r3 wrong move
nhanh [1d\]: still
yakotaki [-\]: mogobot sucks , give him zen
funkymunky [3k\]: find errors, and solve for mates. with deep analysis
]
;B[kg]BL[1972.746]C[yosogo [1d\]: n4 for b
nhanh [1d\]: not playing it is much worse
vandrei [11k\]: give manyfaces
]
;W[qg]WL[2392.667]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: that makes go to the game with more possibilities and needs a better bot
fatihsulak [-\]: i think black doing good so far
Whyyyyy: maybe bot has virus
vandrei [11k\]: lol
funkymunky [3k\]: and it has been found, the grandmasters of history were all quite flawed
mareck [11k\]: who is winning?
vandrei [11k\]: rofl
sushisan [4d\]: bot sucks? call him vacuum cleaner.
bolbi [-\]: zen would not work as well if there was no mogobot
Wagaboo [11k\]: white
yakotaki [-\]: french bot on french computer ... all gote....
Stoneflow [-\]: 361 x (361-x) x is move number. can anyone set up and equation for possibilities intead i think i got it wrong
ARPAnet [5k\]: true bolbi
]
;B[of]BL[1939.267]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: i've never seen a bot attack
WorldCop [2k\]: 361 is wrong
WorldCop [2k\]: ever heard of ko, etc?
vandrei [11k\]: you gonna be kidding
Wagaboo [11k\]: there is ko
]
;W[qi]WL[2368.01]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: and
sushisan [4d\]: if Micro$oft ever makes a product that doesn't suck, it will be a vacuum cleaner
yosogo [1d\]: no stoneflow   you forgot ko
Wagaboo [11k\]: symmetry
Stoneflow [-\]: oh right
Stoneflow [-\]: that fucks things up
pasky [1d?\]: more importantly, no suicide permitted
Wagaboo [11k\]: and forbidden moves
vandrei [11k\]: bafta Catalin
funkymunky [3k\]: microsoft does suck now
nhanh [1d\]: lol sushisan
bolbi [-\]: watch your language please
funkymunky [3k\]: but up to XP they were not bad
]
;B[og]BL[1905.472]
;W[oh]WL[2364.997]C[WorldCop [2k\]: hey we didn't say which ruleset. maybe suicide allowed :)
Stoneflow [-\]: sorry
Whyyyyy: moves very restricted in chess
pasky [1d?\]: worldcop, one-stone suicide is never allowed
xinyil [2k\]: who is playing?
FrodosGban [8k?\]: catalin and superbot
Kilik [1k\]: B and w
]
;B[nj]BL[1871.71]C[fatihsulak [-\]: n4 seems important
WorldCop [2k\]: i see. why not?
YogSothoth [2d\]: MS Excel is a very good product (pretty much the only one though)
petermeter [17k?\]: lol i liked the b and w answer
WorldCop [2k\]: to make the game force to end i suppose
Whyyyyy: long life Excel
nhanh [1d\]: n4 not so important
]
;W[lh]WL[2341.776]C[WorldCop [2k\]: doesn't superko do that?
Stoneflow [-\]: so you cant make an equation then
ARPAnet [5k\]: bolbi, will they also play on 9x9 afterwards?
FrodosGban [8k?\]: guys plz stop arguing about ms products
DangoMango [2k\]: who is egc2010
Whyyyyy: bot
bolbi [-\]: they already played a 9x9 game
FrodosGban [8k?\]: european grand champ??
Onmyoji [-\]: kgs is the best microsoft product
Liisa [2d\]: http://www.egc2010.fi/news.php
MaxMakinen [2k\]: egc2010 is catalin taranu 5p
ARPAnet [5k\]: och, thanks :)
sushisan [4d\]: yeah, please stop, i was just kidding
bolbi [-\]: welcome
Liisa [2d\]: ...info about this game...
]
;B[nf]BL[1837.909]C[Athanor [-\]: European champ is still dinerchtein, for now
Kilik [1k\]: p13 bad..
WorldCop [2k\]: pretty sure not this year :)
funkymunky [3k\]: go breakfast!
Isobeutel [4k\]: now w is in trouble
pasky [1d?\]: EGC2010 is Catalin Taranu 5p; EGC2010bot is MogoTW on 96 cores
Whyyyyy: bot is very time consuming
kill [-\]: 96 score?
kill [-\]: a cores
yakotaki [-\]: 0,4 core
fatihsulak [-\]: attack will probbaly fail
Whyyyyy: bot will suddenly die
Liisa [2d\]: 512 cores...
kill [-\]: what is the bot currently thinking?
daniiil [4k\]: 64x8=512
fatihsulak [-\]: s12 remains
FcoGo [3d\]: s13
MaxMakinen [2k\]: it says on the website its using 512 cores
funkymunky [3k\]: Another way to examine more chess positions is distribute the analysis of positions to many computers. The ChessBrain project[19\]  was a chess program that distributed the search tree computation through the Internet. In 2004 the ChessBrain played chess using 2,070 computers.
Koons [1k\]: kill, you'll have to wait till the post gameinterview :)
Isobeutel [4k\]: how many MHz each core?
funkymunky [3k\]: what we should try on KGS is GOBrain expirment
]
;W[mj]WL[2268.926]C[MaxMakinen [2k\]: funkymonkey can we stop the damn chessbot discussion?
funkymunky [3k\]: sure
sushisan [4d\]: w S12 is honte
Kilik [1k\]: you capy paste wikipedia
kill [-\]: Koons: why, it should be possible to ask for it now
bolbi [-\]: thank you
Isobeutel [4k\]: how many MHz each core?
WorldCop [2k\]: so, any chance of w dying?
yosogo [1d\]: no
yosogo [1d\]: s12
kill [-\]: usually those bots can be asked what they think about the game
]
;B[qn]BL[1804.061]C[Koons [1k\]: actually, i am lead to believe that b doesn't give interviews
YogSothoth [2d\]: w can live on the border
kill [-\]: ie. their estimated probability of winning
FFH [2k\]: how ended 9x9 bot match?
kill [-\]: or something like that
pasky [1d?\]: maxmakinen, you are right, i had old version loaded
bolbi [-\]: catalin won
Wagaboo [11k\]: R6 ouch
sushisan [4d\]: b R6: wins by 0.5
fatihsulak [-\]: very difficult for white now
sushisan [4d\]: :)
Wagaboo [11k\]: much points for B
gogonuts [5d\]: p17?
Bembelbote [-\]: how strong is the bot approx.?
Whyyyyy: SE also competes as a bot at EGC?
Athanor [-\]: weak
yosogo [1d\]: maybe 1d on kgs
MalyJezyk [1d\]: 2d kgs
Athanor [-\]: no 1d would ever play r6 like this
]
;W[ep]WL[2201.069]C[kill [-\]: c17
Kilik [1k\]: lol
Bembelbote [-\]: if he's 1d then bots've gotten decent strong, no?
juhop [1d?\]: yes
yakotaki [-\]: question for the smart, how many MHz have watch 
Whyyyyy: Is SE a bot at all?
ARPAnet [5k\]: Athanor, and what if the 1d wants to win by 0.5?
Liisa [2d\]: i do not think that Mogo could get 2d on kgs, even with supercomp...
]
;B[mi]BL[1770.247]
;W[ni]WL[2197.436]C[sushisan [4d\]: the bot's hull can take about 100 Kg/cm2
Athanor [-\]: ARPAnet : 1d knows how to count?
Korenn [?\]: I hope w tests how good the bot is at ko
WorldCop [2k\]: hm yeah, mogo really bad with ko
]
;B[mh]BL[1736.466]C[WorldCop [2k\]: multiple threats before retaking and stuff
yosogo [1d\]: but now b is still ahead
Athanor [-\]: matter of time
Takimme [1d\]: h6 works now
]
;W[oj]WL[2165.311]C[nhanh [1d\]: w has many good yose moves - not sure that b is ahead
]
;B[nk]BL[1702.663]
;W[ok]WL[2160.09]C[yosogo [1d\]: the top w has many deficit
xinyil [2k\]: Has a bot reached the standard of a strong dan players now?
mikoko [1d\]: b has 6 handi, hes still ahead for a short time
nhanh [1d\]: S12 gives life
petermeter [17k?\]: if the board would look like that for me, i would lose. On either side XD
Athanor [-\]: 7 handi
]
;B[nh]BL[1668.887]
;W[oi]WL[2153.601]C[sheeryjay [1d\]: xinyil, bot plays as 1d-2d on kgs .. but certainly his play is weird, filled with useless moves and tenukis, not something you would like to look up to
MalyJezyk [1d\]: easy win for b unless it blunders several times
FrodosGban [8k?\]: i know its stupid but i want to know if we can learn anything for playing against real humans out of this game
]
;B[li]BL[1635.103]C[nhanh [1d\]: easy win?
MalyJezyk [1d\]: sure
nhanh [1d\]: what do you mean?
Wagaboo [11k\]: o8
MalyJezyk [1d\]: b has more points
]
;W[pl]WL[2128.6]C[fatihsulak [-\]: i didnt get e4 
nhanh [1d\]: e4 to cut at H6
Korenn [?\]: e4 threatens to cut
]
;B[rj]BL[1601.328]C[nhanh [1d\]: b wont have more points
nhanh [1d\]: at the end
FrodosGban [8k?\]: a member of the German Go association told me bots "think" different so you cant really learn anything in a game with them if you want to be stronger vs humans
kill [-\]: jn8
]
;W[pn]WL[2112.839]C[kill [-\]: n8
CGBSpender [4d?\]: b doesn't look so bad
FrodosGban [8k?\]: or at least sth like that
nhanh [1d\]: depends on which bot
yosogo [1d\]: but now there is not many place for w to gain point
Wagaboo [11k\]: humans are more subjective
Wagaboo [11k\]: robots are objective
]
;B[qm]BL[1567.535]C[Wisp [20k\]: who's playing?
nhanh [1d\]: I think manyfaces plays very realistically
]
;W[ml]WL[2109.6]C[yosogo [1d\]: but manyface is weak
MalyJezyk [1d\]: I think that this is easier for b than starting position
petermeter [17k?\]: unfortunately, subjectivity is not really bad nor good...
nhanh [1d\]: I thought manyfaces is one of the stronger bots
]
;B[mk]BL[1533.751]
;W[lk]WL[2107.641]C[WhoKnows [11k\]: will the bot be defeated through time?
Opul3nce [?\]: are people getting confused between hardware and the actually program?
Iruwen [10k?\]: @ Wisp: Catalin
pokp: o8?
]
;B[nl]BL[1499.955]C[kill [-\]: I think it is too late for O8 no?
nhanh [1d\]: O8
]
;W[nm]WL[2100.372]C[pokp: o8 is destroying ws shape
nhanh [1d\]: O8 cuts off M9
]
;B[lj]BL[1466.162]C[kill [-\]: but then H5 will die?
]
;W[ol]WL[2099.172]C[sushisan [4d\]: b knows some shapes
nhanh [1d\]: how strong is the strongest bot?
Opul3nce [?\]: w g8 is big?
Liisa [2d\]: around 2d
MalyJezyk [1d\]: depents upon hardware used
WorldCop [2k\]: 9d, smartrobot is strongest.
MalyJezyk [1d\]: depends
Wagaboo [11k\]: g8 seems big
nhanh [1d\]: :)
WorldCop [2k\]: he has human parts though
nhanh [1d\]: depends?
xinyil [2k\]: 9d -- really?
]
;B[mj]BL[1432.364]C[bolbi [-\]: but pro strenght on 9x9
nhanh [1d\]: what do you man depends?
]
;W[ed]WL[2092.493]C[ARPAnet [5k\]: xinyil, no
ogun [12k\]: g7 is bigger
mareck [11k\]: who is winning
MalyJezyk [1d\]: they are stronger on faster computers
kill [-\]: smartrobot - also called "Jack, the ripper"
]
;B[de]BL[1398.585]
;W[dc]WL[2089.524]C[sushisan [4d\]: and faster on stronger computers
ARPAnet [5k\]: although bots are at pro level on 9x9 if they use supercomputers
nhanh [1d\]: so take the fastest and strongest they ever had
yosogo [1d\]: smartrobot is human?
ARPAnet [5k\]: yes
juhop [1d?\]: you mean one can build a strong bot out of meat??
]
;B[cc]BL[1364.788]
;W[eb]WL[2087.015]C[kill [-\]: superhuman robot
Opul3nce [?\]: doesn't have to be a super computer for 9b9
petermeter [17k?\]: black loses due to time 
sushisan [4d\]: meat bot
nhanh [1d\]: Liisa - which bot is strongest?
Cruzz [3k\]: useless flesh bags have nothing on perfect machines
fatihsulak [-\]: o17 
yosogo [1d\]: m17 or n4
myko [10k\]: Is there a website for the EGC with tables for all the different tournaments?
]
;B[hm]BL[1331.176]C[WorldCop [2k\]: bah, so direct
]
;W[pr]WL[2076.697]C[WorldCop [2k\]: mogo not creative
Dagobert [3d\]: http://www.egc2010.fi/
Liisa [2d\]: http://www.egc2010.fi/news.php
Elarnys [?\]: with H7, you don't really need to be creative xD
badmoves [7k?\]: w f13-e13-g14 is right?
myko [10k\]: Thank you WorldCop and Dagobert! :)
funkymunky [3k\]: Manyfaces about 1d on kgs?
]
;B[qr]BL[1298.388]
;W[oc]WL[2069.325]C[sushisan [4d\]: cat not taking many risks
nhanh [1d\]: E16 bigger than H6?
sushisan [4d\]: w play quite conventional
nhanh [1d\]: he must be winning
]
;B[or]BL[1266.412]C[Koons [1k\]: if conventional = biggest move :)
]
;W[oq]WL[2065.139]C[grzesiek [16k\]: the more  stones there are the better the bot will be, similar in chess, less options means it will be able to compute much better.
kill [-\]: did lee sedol play against a superbot already?
sushisan [4d\]: heh. w can't get psychological advantage
]
;B[pq]BL[1235.216]
;W[nr]WL[2063.638]C[sheeryjay [1d\]: FrodosGban, one thing that you can learn from MC bots is that humans (especially weak) tenuki too few and follow opponent way too much (but the bot overdoes it I guess)
nhanh [1d\]: sure he can
gogonuts [5d\]: the b positions are too thick for crazy w play
pokp: well actually yes he can
gabigo [4k?\]: i think the best bot on kgs is smartrobot :P
Dagobert [3d\]: b + 0.5 ;-)
sushisan [4d\]: you mean bot actually scared?
Takimme [1d\]: it looks game willl be close
Dogen [4k\]: human's going to lose here...
pokp: no lol
WorldCop [2k\]: b still leading more than 10
]
;B[pb]BL[1204.828]C[Takimme [1d\]: yeah
kill [-\]: one could program a bot with fear
fatihsulak [-\]: black still better?
Dagobert [3d\]: worldcop: "still" ..
]
;W[cb]WL[2055.567]C[nhanh [1d\]: no but he feels better if his game is good
pokp: but w can be in a good shape, that's his avantage :)
Liisa [2d\]: w+3,5 
WorldCop [2k\]: yes still. i don't think catalin can make up much more in endgame
Dagobert [3d\]: b will play random moves until he wins by 0.5 ..
Koons [1k\]: this bot has better endgame than me :)
sushisan [4d\]: oh i c. the programmer is sweating
]
;B[lc]BL[1175.197]C[Koons [1k\]: ooooh
sushisan [4d\]: wow
pokp: ahhh
Dogen [4k\]: boom!
]
;W[ld]WL[2046.396]C[GregHouse [2d\]: very nice move
WorldCop [2k\]: cool
yosogo [1d\]: ohohohohoh
fatihsulak [-\]: sudnely bot becomea active :)
slim76 [2d\]: that's the spirit!
gogonuts [5d\]: c18 made mogo angry :-)
nhanh [1d\]: in former days you would simply hide goseigen in a machine
gogonuts [5d\]: it threatens bs win
nhanh [1d\]: he would beat everyone
]
;B[mc]BL[1146.302]C[Takimme [1d\]: bot is counterstriking =P
Gizensha [?\]: spirit in the machine
nhanh [1d\]: M17 really tough
Dagobert [3d\]: haha, nhanh, a few hundred years ago they did that with people to create "chess machines" ;-)
nhanh [1d\]: didnt know b can do that
nhanh [1d\]: I know
sushisan [4d\]: goseigen jumps out of a giant pie: HIIII
yosogo [1d\]: maybe this  is not a bot , it is a  human behind
nhanh [1d\]: yes, but who?
]
;W[kc]WL[1965.139]C[ARPAnet [5k\]: a KGS 2d :)
Takimme [1d\]: it is me =P
slim76 [2d\]: human behind is almost as strong as human head
WorldCop [2k\]: takimme, you're good ;)
gogonuts [5d\]: o17 didnt work for w
nhanh [1d\]: this is painful
]
;B[ob]BL[1118.1]C[Takimme [1d\]: WorldCop, thx =)
WorldCop [2k\]: b+20 on the board
nhanh [1d\]: b could O16
yosogo [1d\]: w got no chance
]
;W[he]WL[1947.455]C[nhanh [1d\]: or O17
Isobeutel [4k\]: exellent yose. if b wins, then regame with 6 hc!
WorldCop [2k\]: you wish, or is it real?
]
;B[fk]BL[1090.596]C[nhanh [1d\]: I think E16 was a mistake
nhanh [1d\]: the area actually not so big
nhanh [1d\]: cutting at H6 was better
fatihsulak [-\]: f9 huge btw
fatihsulak [-\]: b17 
kill [-\]: p1
yosogo [1d\]: b lead by more then 25
]
;W[dr]WL[1883.284]C[sushisan [4d\]: exception: illegal call to comp_points(int x, int y) in module endgame.py
nhanh [1d\]: w lost too much, yes
betise [1d\]: b17 is worth a lot
myko [10k\]: So EGC2010 is Catalin Taranu, is that right?
Khim [1k\]: s14 too
]
;B[cr]BL[1063.823]C[WorldCop [2k\]: did you forget to include module brain?
ARPAnet [5k\]: import brain
MalyJezyk [1d\]: brain is obsolete
Dagobert [3d\]: 404 module brain not found
WorldCop [2k\]: from gu li
nhanh [1d\]: O8 and M17 winning moves
gabigo [4k?\]: f13 ?
]
;W[nd]WL[1855.936]C[nhanh [1d\]: b's endgame is good - not much w can do
pasky [1d?\]: i think black is ahead?
FFH [2k\]: does Catalin play on real board or on computer?
Isobeutel [4k\]: most important is the module "ownage"
nhanh [1d\]: do you think?
Koons [1k\]: what's so special about  o8?
nhanh [1d\]: why do you ask?
]
;B[nc]BL[1037.727]C[slim76 [2d\]: b +25
yosogo [1d\]: yes
pasky [1d?\]: nhanh: it's called "phrase" or "figure of speech"
lanchow [3k\]: is a pro loosing against a bot ? is it possible ?
WorldCop [2k\]: b will manage to make this 0.5 win
]
;W[lb]WL[1833.791]C[pasky [1d?\]: FFH: unfortunately, he is playing on a notebook :)
slim76 [2d\]: lanchow, it is when bot gets 7 handi
nhanh [1d\]: really? dont think so
Takimme [1d\]: w still has chance to win by time =)
]
;B[mb]BL[1012.253]
;W[ma]WL[1832.425]C[FFH [2k\]: ok
kaulopur [-\]: the bot knows how to handle time
pasky [1d?\]: in front of an auditorium filled with people silently watching the KGS window
FrodosGban [8k?\]: lol
yosogo [1d\]: the only chance for w is time
sushisan [4d\]: just wait till my VB bot is finished
betise [1d\]: must be hard to win by time against a bot
nhanh [1d\]: i thought either you say I think... or you ask Is ...?
bolbi [-\]: lanchow : 9p already lost a 9x9 game against bot
]
;B[nb]BL[987.394]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: funny thinking about o18
WorldCop [2k\]: can you trace your opponents IP with it?
SciSan [5k?\]: time tesuji: make crazy move and wait bot to waste all its time
nhanh [1d\]: dont want to be a grammar nazi though
]
;W[jf]WL[1817.612]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: i would try to program a bot ^^
Wagaboo [11k\]: is it difficult?
FrodosGban [8k?\]: haha
yakotaki [-\]: :P
nhanh [1d\]: randombot is easy
WorldCop [2k\]: weekend job
FrodosGban [8k?\]: its like hell
]
;B[kf]BL[963.118]C[pasky [1d?\]: Wagaboo: it depends on how strong would you like it to be
nhanh [1d\]: resignbot even easier
Wagaboo [11k\]: XD you're crazy guys
pasky [1d?\]: Wagaboo: just implementing go rules can be a bit boring and tedious work though if you aren't too experienced
WorldCop [2k\]: idiotbot is kinda strong
]
;W[ke]WL[1783.431]C[masek [?\]: congress of bot's 2010 ?
sushisan [4d\]: IF myturn == true THEN resign()
masek [?\]: is it true ?
Kickchon [?\]: actually is there an interface to program a go bot for kgs ?
]
;B[kb]BL[939.483]
;W[jb]WL[1780.248]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: i've solid programation bases
SciSan [5k?\]: I'd like to make bot that makes bots
nhanh [1d\]: better is IF myturn Then resign()
yosogo [1d\]: resign time for w
pasky [1d?\]: kickchon: there is generic communication protocol for bots (GTP) that you can connect to some gui program or to kgs
pasky [1d?\]: *use to
]
;B[la]BL[916.444]C[Korenn [?\]: I expected w to try a ko there
badmoves [7k?\]: f13 is bad?
]
;W[jg]WL[1778.256]C[Takimme [1d\]: w has k13 
coOooL [3k\]: K13
sushisan [4d\]: nhanh: illegal in pseudo code
Takimme [1d\]: yes
Takimme [1d\]: it is painfull
Q161 [?\]: yeah but your bot is flawed sushi
nhanh [1d\]: :) I thought it was C++
Q161 [?\]: you can resign if its not your turn
]
;B[os]BL[893.909]C[yakotaki [-\]: b9 !
Q161 [?\]: so there can be a stronger resign bot
dmf [15k?\]: wut?
lanchow [3k\]: P9?
pasky [1d?\]: murmur in the audience
nhanh [1d\]: resign() with brackets is pseudo codes?
]
;W[ns]WL[1765.38]C[lanchow [3k\]: P1?
WorldCop [2k\]: C++ has no "then"
slim76 [2d\]: bot starts to get tired
nhanh [1d\]: ahh - I am not a programmer, sorry
]
;B[ps]BL[872.023]
;W[po]WL[1762.761]C[nhanh [1d\]: can someone teach me?
yosogo [1d\]: will bot get tired
sushisan [4d\]: you could hack C++ to support keyword THEN
Kyoji [4k\]: who is w ?
Takimme [1d\]: why w not l12 ?
gabigo [4k?\]: l12 small?
nhanh [1d\]: Is there a good online course?
usagi [1d\]: then is a holdover from basic when they didn't have code blocks.
betise [1d\]: is mogo predicting 100% win and can't distinguish moves ?
]
;B[qo]BL[850.663]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: how a go player thinks?
Iciac [5k\]: s14 big and sente
lanchow [3k\]: P1 is a huge mistake no ?
Takimme [1d\]: yeah
dmf [15k?\]: seems so
SciSan [5k?\]: seems bad to me
coOooL [3k\]: j13,b17,l12  ...
Koons [1k\]: huge?
betise [1d\]: not huge but sure it's a mistake
Dagobert [3d\]: define "mistake"
karudosu [15k\]: can't you create the function THEN()
sushisan [4d\]: a go player stinks badly
WorldCop [2k\]: no huge mistake. b just upping the win certainty
Wagaboo [11k\]: what is the most important in go?
Dagobert [3d\]: is it a mistake if b wins?
Takimme [1d\]: looks b's cpu is overhot
Wagaboo [11k\]: is it to be sente?
MalyJezyk [1d\]: not big enough to lose
fatihsulak [-\]: p1 is like 2-4 points mistake
nhanh [1d\]: IF myturn THEN()
HikaruLowl [5k\]: if(myturn) resign();
nhanh [1d\]: what bot is this?
yosogo [1d\]: b lead by 25
Nickless [2d\]: thats going to be awesome if bot overheats the supercomputer : D
]
;W[ji]WL[1693.696]C[Iciac [5k\]: http://www.egc2010.fi/news.php
Wagaboo [11k\]: it's resign bot
Wagaboo [11k\]: a 1000000k bot
FrodosGban [8k?\]: left white is alive
nhanh [1d\]: thenbot?
nhanh [1d\]: zenbot?
]
;B[ii]BL[829.923]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: i thought there is inly like 70k
]
;W[ih]WL[1688.884]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: *only
yosogo [1d\]: 70k ?
Koons [1k\]: its a trap
nhanh [1d\]: IF myturm zen()
FrodosGban [8k?\]: the highest k
]
;B[hi]BL[809.647]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: 70
FrodosGban [8k?\]: or 80?
yosogo [1d\]: 30?
Wagaboo [11k\]: l'inconscient et le psychisme de l'etre humain sont ils liés par une métenpsychose?
sushisan [4d\]: please comment on the game. bot might get embarrassed
]
;W[kh]WL[1665.143]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: ok
Kyoji [4k\]: who is w ?
Wagaboo [11k\]: b is dead everywhere
nhanh [1d\]: can b hear us?
yosogo [1d\]: bot still ahead
Dagobert [3d\]: w = catalin
Laman [1d\]: programming bot is easy... return possibleMoves[rand(0,count(possibleMoves)-1)\]
Gay [5d\]: yes
]
;B[lg]BL[789.872]C[zakatan [6k\]: w 5p
Kickchon [?\]: hmm i wonder if i may program a go bot as my master thesis at my university, would be fun :P
Iciac [5k\]: The bot is reading comments.
WorldCop [2k\]: hm good for w
WorldCop [2k\]: l10 or what?
kaulopur [-\]: Laman, what if count(PossibleMoves)==0?
Korenn [?\]: lol
nhanh [1d\]: Is this good style Laman?
Takimme [1d\]: l10 
SciSan [5k?\]: your thesis on what subject
Kyoji [4k\]: the bot is HAL
Koons [1k\]: what is better  b b18 for ko, or b17 just to minimize w  there?
MalyJezyk [1d\]: l10 sucks
Korenn [?\]: a bot that reads comments would be quite funny :P
]
;W[rg]WL[1615.744]C[yosogo [1d\]: bot do not need ko
Dogen [4k\]: huh?
FrodosGban [8k?\]: you can feed bot with keywords
Laman [1d\]: if(count(PossibleMoves)==0){pass()}
Dogen [4k\]: why not L10?
SciSan [5k?\]: I konw! A kibitz bot!
FrodosGban [8k?\]: bad move and so on
nhanh [1d\]: a bot that chat woould be nice
MalyJezyk [1d\]: l10 l9 
]
;B[bk]BL[770.617]C[Dagobert [3d\]: kaulopur: that may happen after 1000 moves ;-)
Takimme [1d\]: oh
WorldCop [2k\]: ooh, sented
nhanh [1d\]: you improve your socializing skills
Takimme [1d\]: hehe =)
yosogo [1d\]: s15 is bigger
Muscadet [?\]: b17
kaulopur [-\]: dagobert, if the program crashes at that point, there's a simple strategy for consistently beating the bot :)
WorldCop [2k\]: not if this threatens life
kaulopur [-\]: oh, hrm, or not
Muscadet [?\]: b17
Dagobert [3d\]: i think the human "crashes" before the program
]
;W[bc]WL[1542.283]C[karudosu [15k\]: can't we do it recursively?
]
;B[ck]BL[751.804]
;W[eo]WL[1538.311]C[Iciac [5k\]: The human crashes the program, creating an expensive display of supercomputer fireworks :D
]
;B[dl]BL[733.482]
;W[el]WL[1535.628]C[kaulopur [-\]: everything can be done recursively, but i'd advise against it
]
;B[fl]BL[715.591]
;W[em]WL[1531.899]C[nhanh [1d\]: everthing can be done recursively?
nhanh [1d\]: what do you mean?
]
;B[op]BL[698.241]C[Iciac [5k\]: black does not like ko?
]
;W[np]WL[1528.649]C[Dagobert [3d\]: b wins without ko
kaulopur [-\]: nhanh, it's a koan
ARPAnet [5k\]: w probably has more ko threats?
karudosu [15k\]: (19x19 possibilities in recursive programmation ... hard)
nhanh [1d\]: koan?
]
;B[ch]BL[681.27]
;W[ci]WL[1525.114]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: ko is a risk for a bot
WorldCop [2k\]: b is getting weird. maybe not so far ahead
]
;B[eg]BL[664.691]C[yosogo [1d\]: yes
WorldCop [2k\]: or it doesn't matter
Djaian [-\]: if white can monkey jump at t16...
FrodosGban [8k?\]: for ko you need to have experience
hatego [3k\]: Koan the barbarian
]
;W[be]WL[1511.231]C[NschoTschi [-\]: Black is win?
karudosu [15k\]: ...
yosogo [1d\]: a10
kaulopur [-\]: koan the barbarian, baffling his enemies to death
Peritoine [2k?\]: what is EGC2010 rank?
]
;B[aj]BL[648.552]
;W[bi]WL[1508.431]C[Dagobert [3d\]: 5p
ilfuria [7k\]: 5p
betise [1d\]: looks like black play as if white would not answer his moves
FrodosGban [8k?\]: who programmed this bot?
SciSan [5k?\]: The further game goes, the stronger will bot be, right?
Peritoine [2k?\]: and the bot?
coOooL [3k\]: W endgame impressive ...
]
;B[mm]BL[632.798]C[Takimme [1d\]: looks b+10
Dogen [4k\]: does the human's rank go down if he loses to the bot?
nhanh [1d\]: how can I cook coffee recursively?
pasky [1d?\]: scisan: in theory
grzesiek [16k\]: scisan, it should
Wagaboo [11k\]: depends on how's programation
WorldCop [2k\]: oh wow, sente fix
hatego [3k\]: No, but your mom can. Oh, snap!
NschoTschi [-\]: more than 10
daredevil [1k\]: pro is used to catching up in yose in a handi game .. doesn't work against bot
FrodosGban [8k?\]: bot can guess his opponent better after 170 turns
]
;W[ri]WL[1475.13]C[nhanh [1d\]: I dont think so Scisan
pasky [1d?\]: daredevil: catalin already played mogotw several times before
Babibo [2d\]: while coffee not ready cook coffee
gogonuts [5d\]: taking away the last pooints from the bot is hardest
pasky [1d?\]: so he knows his opponent well
FrodosGban [8k?\]: anticipation for bots^^
nhanh [1d\]: I think bot good at opening and endgame
WorldCop [2k\]: now s14 b sente too, no?
nhanh [1d\]: middle game is worst
pasky [1d?\]: mogo crashed
NschoTschi [-\]: t14 
WorldCop [2k\]: aha. escaper bot!
hatego [3k\]: Bot just uses a book for opening, no?
yosogo [1d\]: b is still far ahead
EGC2010Bot [-\]: GTP Engine for EGC2010Bot (black): MoGo version MoGo version 4.86.Soissons: I'll resign if you win and playing until you pass if I win. If you passed and I did not, it often means that the status of some stones are not clear enough for me (I want to be sure we will agree on dead stones). Clarify them. Maybe I am losing, but have not enough time to be sure I should resign. In this case play until the end :'( (very rare cases)
Muscadet [?\]: w closing the gap to about 18 p
Korenn [?\]: rotfl
Dagobert [3d\]: taking away the last points is easy .. it´s more difficult to take away the last 0.5 point ;-)
]
;B[cd]BL[603.545]
;W[bd]WL[1470.089]C[NschoTschi [-\]: t16 
calik [9k\]: s15?
gogonuts [5d\]: not a full board book
Korenn [?\]: moral victory for W because he crashed his opponent!
gabigo [4k?\]: maybe b will lose on time
]
;B[rf]BL[588.945]C[Takimme [1d\]: b16 lol
]
;W[sf]WL[1467.048]C[yosogo [1d\]: b win
yakotaki [-\]: l10 !
]
;B[qk]BL[574.665]C[WorldCop [2k\]: lol
daniiil [4k\]: did bot feel moral loose?
Takimme [1d\]: l10 doesnt work
WorldCop [2k\]: bot counting master
ZeroWave [11k?\]: R9?
nhanh [1d\]: lol babibo
Opul3nce [?\]: wonder if it knows to go fast when time runs down
NschoTschi [-\]: hope comes back?
Dagobert [3d\]: looks like b+0.5 ;-)
ilfuria [7k\]: Game: W+crash
mareck [11k\]: L10
Kyoji [4k\]: lol
nhanh [1d\]: so this is called "done" recursively?
pasky [1d?\]: catalin looks at the board sceptically
gogonuts [5d\]: s11 was a nice move
yosogo [1d\]: why not a15
yosogo [1d\]: t15
sushisan [4d\]: stack overflow
Neon [11k\]: l10?
NschoTschi [-\]: r9 is why i dont like botgames
Wagaboo [11k\]: T15?
]
;W[sd]WL[1396.294]C[FrodosGban [8k?\]: w l10
FrodosGban [8k?\]: L10
kaulopur [-\]: nhanh, don't get too obsessed, remember your blood pressure
pasky [1d?\]: oh?
Wagaboo [11k\]: 16 sry ^^
gogonuts [5d\]: b t15,w t10, t9, t12
]
;B[od]BL[560.736]C[yosogo [1d\]: ?
nhanh [1d\]: I had a lot of coffee today
yakotaki [-\]: :p
Wagaboo [11k\]: uwo Oo
nhanh [1d\]: :)
SciSan [5k?\]: wut
]
;W[rb]WL[1388.302]C[WorldCop [2k\]: haha. go on, take teh corner
Iciac [5k\]: rofl
Takimme [1d\]: lol
pasky [1d?\]: the audience smiles silently
Opul3nce [?\]: What the hell was R9?
Isobeutel [4k\]: b plays nonsense
gogonuts [5d\]: big turnaround
nhanh [1d\]: blood pressure ok
mur [1k\]: i may try to explain: black not is sure he will win
]
;B[rc]BL[547.185]C[sushisan [4d\]: bot got bored
st21 [-\]: b already win
]
;W[sc]WL[1386.67]C[slim76 [2d\]: now it's close
gasana [3k\]: bot soooo good at yose
SciSan [5k?\]: p16 whaat
mur [1k\]: so no matter how exactly
Kyoji [4k\]: lol
mur [1k\]: by 1 pt or by 20
NschoTschi [-\]: c1 big now
mur [1k\]: doesn't matter for computer
]
;B[ki]BL[533.966]C[ZeroWave [11k?\]: ok, now the winner is unclear
yosogo [1d\]: wmaybe bot do not want to win
Neon [11k\]: :( l10 gone
]
;W[jh]WL[1378.897]C[Opul3nce [?\]: bot playing for draw and in doing so w wins YOSE?
nhanh [1d\]: kaulopur - I thought everything can be done NONrecursivele
]
;B[re]BL[521.078]
;W[se]WL[1375.664]C[shikashogi [10k\]: bot plans to show his greatness by knowing he can win by 0.5
hatego [3k\]: No stream of this? I wanted to see a big black box with a hat on sitting in a chair.
sushisan [4d\]: please catalin 3p, take some points & try to make game of this
SciSan [5k?\]: :)
]
;B[ds]BL[508.488]C[Wagaboo [11k\]: huhu maybe
]
;W[es]WL[1371.652]C[kaulopur [-\]: nhanh: cookCoffee(Coffee c) { if(! c.ready()) cookCoffee(c); }
WorldCop [2k\]: still b+10, and not much possible mistakes left :)
]
;B[cs]BL[496.207]
;W[do]WL[1370.191]C[ilfuria [7k\]: sushisan, catalin is 5p
pasky [1d?\]: hatego: eurogotv is capturing this on a camera (must be very exciting video stream), but no live stream afaik
Koons [1k\]: was r9 really bigger than t15?
]
;B[co]BL[484.251]
;W[dq]WL[1368.772]C[hatego [3k\]: Thanks, pasky.
Muscadet [?\]: d1 was big
Elarnys [?\]: No...
Koons [1k\]: or just a big miscalc?
WorldCop [2k\]: hah. this is supposed sente?
]
;B[hh]BL[472.607]
;W[cp]WL[1365.792]C[nhanh [1d\]: dont understand :)
Opul3nce [?\]: how strong is w?
Dagobert [3d\]: pasky: is eurogo sitting in front of the supercomputer? ;-)
]
;B[bp]BL[461.272]C[ilfuria [7k\]: 5p
Opul3nce [?\]: 1-3p?
coOooL [3k\]: 5p
Opul3nce [?\]: 5p?
Opul3nce [?\]: wow
mur [1k\]: 5p
Opul3nce [?\]: bot is good
ZeroWave [11k?\]: japaneese?
pasky [1d?\]: dagobert: the supercomputer is somewhere in helsinki, unfortunately :)
Takimme [1d\]: g7 
Khim [1k\]: bot has 7 stones.
WhitePawn [2k\]: B is trying to make it close
yakotaki [-\]: p7 
WorldCop [2k\]: pff. like 5p is stronger than 1p.
pasky [1d?\]: dagobert: it's too hot here for it
hatego [3k\]: Well, keep in mind the 7h.
]
;W[lf]WL[1337.645]C[WhitePawn [2k\]: bots tend to do that for some reaso
Opul3nce [?\]: helsinki...iceland?
Kaizoku3 [2k\]: i want lesson for this bot :-D
juhop [1d?\]: the bot is not trying to maximize points, just to win
]
;B[mg]BL[450.173]C[yosogo [1d\]: bot still ahead
ilfuria [7k\]: helsinki finland I think
]
;W[gf]WL[1333.625]C[pasky [1d?\]: opul3nce, you fail
SciSan [5k?\]: in Finland
Berodan [7k\]: g7 is big for white?
kaulopur [-\]: someone should write a faq about monte carlo bots
Opul3nce [?\]: sweden
]
;B[if]BL[439.365]C[nhanh [1d\]: b about 78
yakotaki [-\]: finland ?where its ?
Opul3nce [?\]: finland
pasky [1d?\]: kaulopur, what should be inside?
Wagaboo [11k\]: yes G7
Opul3nce [?\]: norway
Opul3nce [?\]: estonia
yakotaki [-\]: aa ok
Opul3nce [?\]: demark
Opul3nce [?\]: your mum
SciSan [5k?\]: I smell trolling
]
;W[ie]WL[1312.121]C[kaulopur [-\]: pasky: why do they always win by 0.5? what are they thinking? maybe they will run out of time? etc.
ARPAnet [5k\]: i guess w already lost if the bot tries to minimize the score difference.
]
;B[lo]BL[428.863]
;W[lp]WL[1309.213]C[nhanh [1d\]: w about 62
Iciac [5k\]: I just had a nice image of the programmer beating the computer with his hat if it loses ^.^
sushisan [4d\]: bots hate losing face
WorldCop [2k\]: b should p7 already, get that ponnuki
]
;B[fm]BL[418.639]C[pasky [1d?\]: kaulopur: ah... that's too general, but for programmers, the presentation at http://pasky.or.cz/~pasky/go/ might be interesting
]
;W[gg]WL[1285.885]C[gogonuts [5d\]: b win unshakable
]
;B[gh]BL[408.589]C[SciSan [5k?\]: I would have liked to see even game
Wagaboo [11k\]: i got a huge idea
Koons [1k\]: even game would be brutal i suspect
kaulopur [-\]: pasky: i was thinking specifically something that can be given to layman kibitzers
Wagaboo [11k\]: that can be funny
gogonuts [5d\]: even game would be useless
Wagaboo [11k\]: you take 2 comuters go
sushisan [4d\]: if win_margin < 0 seppuku
Kickchon [?\]: hmm, i dont see why the bot would like to minimize the score, maximizing the win chance and minimizing score is not directly related :o
karudosu [15k\]: if you lower your score to increase the probability to win, it's god. that's why they always win by only 0.5
ARPAnet [5k\]: even game -> w+resign
Exologist [2k\]: maybe w should've used more of his time
Wagaboo [11k\]: and make them play a rengo
NschoTschi [-\]: Area scoring!!!
zakatan [6k\]: what if b o6?
]
;W[qb]WL[1227.983]
;B[nn]BL[398.842]C[nhanh [1d\]: is there a kibitzbot?
zakatan [6k\]: oh there we go
sushisan [4d\]: does b have a neurotic network?
WorldCop [2k\]: r18 really cool
]
;W[qa]WL[1210.913]C[ZeroWave [11k?\]: o6? not p7?
nhanh [1d\]: you only have to modify SE a bit
yakotaki [-\]: havent
]
;B[om]BL[389.344]C[kaulopur [-\]: sushisan, no, that'd be me
Korenn [?\]: neurotic network rotfl
]
;W[mo]WL[1200.25]
;B[pm]BL[380.076]
;W[oo]WL[1196.797]C[nhanh [1d\]: neurotic:)
]
;B[si]BL[370.994]C[WorldCop [2k\]: i wonder why the bot doesn't j13
hatego [3k\]: B has a positronic neural net.
]
;W[sh]WL[1189.79]C[WorldCop [2k\]: should be favorable in every possible playout
Bembelbote [-\]: N5 was kinda smalish, no?
]
;B[dp]BL[362.217]C[dentist [1k?\]: if my girlfriend ist together with her girlies - that you can call a neurotic network...
Takimme [1d\]: lol
]
;W[sj]WL[1183.046]C[Opul3nce [?\]: bto doesn't care
Korenn [?\]: worldcop: j13 is dame?
Opul3nce [?\]: bot*
pasky [1d?\]: audience giggles
]
;B[sk]BL[353.599]C[WorldCop [2k\]: dame is a point
Opul3nce [?\]: bot is laughing at pro
]
;W[ne]WL[1174.105]
;B[mf]BL[345.225]C[nhanh [1d\]: can w paly it worldcop?
Isobeutel [4k\]: chinese rules
SciSan [5k?\]: just imagine, mechanical laugh after game
Exologist [2k\]: bot should play pro even
]
;W[rd]WL[1154.406]C[sushisan [4d\]: according to luckyNumbers(), J13 brings bad luck
SciSan [5k?\]: ha.ha.ha
]
;B[le]BL[337.032]
;W[qd]WL[1148.179]C[Takimme [1d\]: ohohoho
Pische [-\]: this bot sucks
emerus [5k\]: Bot gave caitlin 9 stones?
emerus [5k\]: nice
]
;B[je]BL[329.04]
;W[jd]WL[1145.775]C[WorldCop [2k\]: nhanh, some variations w will not protect, so i don't understand why he doesn't play
]
;B[pc]BL[321.276]C[nhanh [1d\]: well avoid(13-line)
Chrom [3k\]: if you win with 7 handi, so what does that mean? At least not, that you are stronger
]
;W[fn]WL[1130.948]C[yosogo [1d\]: maybe bot lose by  time
Opul3nce [?\]: bot maybe doens't need the handicap system...he is just throwing points away because he is ahead
]
;B[gn]BL[313.699]
;W[ai]WL[1120.78]C[SciSan [5k?\]:  triple ko
Koons [1k\]: w will start several kos and b will make point losing threats
WhitePawn [2k\]: w cant win he dosnt have anywhere left to go
]
;B[ig]BL[306.351]C[Koons [1k\]: and w will win
]
;W[je]WL[1117.777]C[WorldCop [2k\]: or maybe game is closer than i thought, 7 points for the handicap stones?
FFH [2k\]: k19 big?
]
;B[fe]BL[299.201]C[WorldCop [2k\]: ah finally
]
;W[ge]WL[1114.993]
;B[oe]BL[292.17]C[NschoTschi [-\]: b+7
Chrom [3k\]: 7 handi around 70 points advantage....
gasana [3k\]: tripel ko on the left^^
Khim [1k\]: ...
emerus [5k\]: it's like 50 points
emerus [5k\]: lol
SciSan [5k?\]: neither will win
Vanetti [-\]: i thought 6.5 points per stone
ilfuria [7k\]: lol
Khim [1k\]: it's not triple ko
dentist [1k?\]: a9
WorldCop [2k\]: 1 point per stone for scoring is what i mean
Khim [1k\]: it's only three ko.
betise [1d\]: vanetti: more kinda 14 pts per stone
Dagobert [3d\]: some people say 1 stone is about 12 points worth
]
;W[ak]WL[1068.884]C[imback [3k\]: triple ko doesnt matter black is too far ahead
hatego [3k\]: Seems impossible for W?
betise [1d\]: 2 times komi
nhanh [1d\]: 73 for b?
]
;B[cp]BL[285.398]C[betise [1d\]: but it's probably not linear
Opul3nce [?\]: Vanetti...getting to go first with a stone anywhere ...should be arround 6.5 but the hoshi points are worth about 10
WorldCop [2k\]: b so crazy
]
;W[pa]WL[1050.36]C[WorldCop [2k\]: let me protect this huge ko
]
;B[fg]BL[278.715]C[fatihsulak [-\]: black algorithm fails at f1 
Vanetti [-\]: ok, thx
]
;W[oa]WL[1042.968]
;B[na]BL[272.196]
;W[ja]WL[1042.112]
;B[cl]BL[265.834]C[hfdtd [2d\]: 5 stones about 60 points
]
;W[ka]WL[1037.899]C[nhanh [1d\]: b by 9
]
;B[lb]BL[259.666]C[pasky [1d?\]: they just carrie dthe video camera away
hfdtd [2d\]: 7 stones about 100 points
]
;W[al]WL[1027.707]
;B[am]BL[253.648]
;W[aj]WL[1026.884]C[hfdtd [2d\]: 9 stones about 145 points
NschoTschi [-\]: haha with this crrappy b endgame w willwin in the end
]
;B[qe]BL[247.738]C[Exologist [2k\]: first stone is worth about 12 pts.... they only do half of it to make the game even = 6.5
yosogo [1d\]: over
]
;W[kd]WL[1020.562]C[betise [1d\]: 17 stones about 361 pts ?
sheeryjay [1k\]: there was a camera?
]
;B[me]BL[242.015]C[NschoTschi [-\]: t11 
]
;W[si]WL[1011.125]
;B[ff]BL[236.403]C[Cruzz [3k\]: Nscho: so you're going to manage to grab another 14 points for white from this situation? Good luck
ZeroWave [11k?\]: E6
]
;W[gq]WL[1000.656]C[sushisan [4d\]: can both players consult SE?
]
;B[pk]BL[230.937]
;W[en]WL[997.046]
;B[sb]BL[225.639]
;W[sa]WL[995.004]C[NschoTschi [-\]: Cruzz SE wrong@ area scoring
emerus [5k\]: The bot doesnt care about score
]
;B[kj]BL[220.419]C[coOooL [3k\]: just the bot .. =)
SciSan [5k?\]: what's the minimum nuber of stones that secure whole board
nhanh [1d\]: bot has SE built in
]
;W[hf]WL[987.927]C[sushisan [4d\]: poor bot 
DeadTired [2d\]: didn't you hear? the bot playing is SE mark 2.
]
;B[qp]BL[215.37]C[gogonuts [5d\]: lol
pasky [1d?\]: laughter gets louder
]
;W[mn]WL[978.984]C[nhanh [1d\]: now comes the crappy moves
betise [1d\]: nhanh actually i don't think so
chimbba [2k\]: stupid bot
Kickchon [?\]: ?
]
;B[nm]BL[210.462]C[WorldCop [2k\]: lol
Draqon [1k\]: the bot is filling, upto 1 point difference
rifampicin [-\]: i think the bot will win by 0.5
WorldCop [2k\]: so bad
]
;W[on]WL[973.612]C[hatego [3k\]: That implies that something can be > SE which is heresy.
yosogo [1d\]: ?????
betise [1d\]: bot only compute chances of win
Altist [1d\]: lol
]
;B[lq]BL[205.663]C[Kickchon [?\]: rofl
]
;W[kq]WL[969.643]C[SciSan [5k?\]: wuut
nhanh [1d\]: this is how bots work
Altist [1d\]: loooool
WorldCop [2k\]: is he losing or what is this? :)
]
;B[mq]BL[200.996]C[yosogo [1d\]: what is the bot do
]
;W[mp]WL[967.916]C[dmf [15k?\]: what
DeadTired [2d\]: hatego, development is not always improvement :)
]
;B[ij]BL[196.434]C[sushisan [4d\]: how much does cat get for losing by 0.5+
apina [1k\]: this bot can't pass?
pasky [1d?\]: this is normal
nhanh [1d\]: :)
Opul3nce [?\]: lol just pass
]
;W[]WL[967.914]
;B[]BL[196.433]TW[aa][ba][ca][da][ea][fa][ga][ha][ia][ra][ab][bb][db][fb][gb][hb][ib][sb][ac][ec][gc][hc][ic][ad][gd][hd][id][ae][af][ag][sg][ah][ph][qh][rh][ip][jp][kp][hq][jq][lq][mq][er][fr][gr][hr][ir][jr][kr][lr][mr][fs][gs][hs][is][js][ks][ls][ms]TB[ma][oc][pe][lf][ng][fh][fi][gi][fj][hj][gk][hk][ik][jk][kk][lk][rk][gl][hl][il][jl][kl][ll][ml][rl][sl][gm][im][jm][rm][sm][an][bn][hn][rn][sn][ao][ro][so][ap][rp][sp][aq][bq][rq][sq][ar][br][pr][rr][sr][as][bs][qs][rs][ss]C[pasky [1d?\]: it won't pass until the opponent does
ilfuria [7k\]: 1.5
hatego [3k\]: GG
SciSan [5k?\]: oh
Opul3nce [?\]: omg tyhe terminator is commng
yosogo [1d\]: gg
CalculusHK [14k\]: ...
ZeroWave [11k?\]: and w still lost
yosogo [1d\]: gg
imback [3k\]: who is white?
emerus [5k\]: white is bot
sushisan [4d\]: rich programmers can pay pros to lose
emerus [5k\]: stronger than lee sedol
Korenn [?\]: gratz to the programmers!
hatego [3k\]: None of those moves netted any pointed, Zero.
JulesCesar [4d\]: w is catalin taranu 5p
Wagaboo [11k\]: gratz to pro
hatego [3k\]: points*
coOooL [3k\]: komi is just 0.5
coOooL [3k\]: ....
Kyoji [4k\]: id like to see bot vs bot
Iciac [5k\]: Cue ominous mechanical voice "GG"
coOooL [3k\]: ??
mur [1k\]: will there be the next one?
Wagaboo [11k\]: 7 stone is so much
Djaian [-\]: It seemed like the pro didn't play very seriously
yosogo [1d\]: bot is crazy in the end
vaxou [4k\]: thanks :)
Opul3nce [?\]: gratz everyone who put on this spectical
Draqon [1k\]: 6 stones next year
mur [1k\]: next year?!
sushisan [4d\]: catalin gets $100 for every point he loses by
mur [1k\]: i thought today:(
altrecop [1k\]: NOW!
Koons [1k\]: bot needs some endgame study
coOooL [3k\]: catalin is really strong ...
Koons [1k\]: else impressive
Lesmian [1k\]: 5 stones for catalin in 2020
IstTengen [3k\]: MoGo won last year as well
kaulopur [-\]: thanks for playing with mogo, mr. Țăranu
dagwood [7k?\]: should be best of 3 games
pasky [1d?\]: catalin compliments mogo on its fighting skill
ARPAnet [5k\]: so you really think, w didn't play seriously? What do the high dans think about this?
Koons [1k\]: i would think endgame would be easiest to program through brute force
IstTengen [3k\]: endgame and fighting
pasky [1d?\]: he says he expected mogo to win on 9x9 and lose on 19x19
emerus [5k\]: i think a lot of the new boths strength comes from
pasky [1d?\]: he says "congratulations mogo!"
emerus [5k\]: pro game openings or something
ARPAnet [5k\]: hmm thanks pasky
MalyJezyk [1d\]: b is programmed in such a way that it can't see the difference between 0.5 win and a 100 point win
MalyJezyk [1d\]: so you can't really say that it played bad yose
Koons [1k\]: Maly, that seems silly
MalyJezyk [1d\]: it works
Koons [1k\]: there is no way its endgame maximized chance of winning
ARPAnet [5k\]: Koons, the go rules don't say that one should win by more than 100 points.
Koons [1k\]: i agree but block and connect is kinda natural
Koons [1k\]: for a reason :)
kaulopur [-\]: natural to human players
juhop [1d?\]: koons, just build a stronger bot, I assure the alternatives have been tried :)
Iciac [5k\]: It's probably programmed in such a way that it truncates paths to find a 0.5 win.
hfdtd [2d\]: the program chooses the move with the maximum of winning probability
hfdtd [2d\]: not the maximum of winning points
Koons [1k\]: i hear you, i am just skeptical
emerus [5k\]: it uses monte carlo?
MalyJezyk [1d\]: yes
ARPAnet [5k\]: yes, UCT
betise [1d\]: probability is given by random play for remaining intersections
ARPAnet [5k\]: well "refined" UCT
hfdtd [2d\]: it seems to be a stupid algorithmn but it works
Koons [1k\]: that algorithm seems to work well early and middle, but seems to be silly at the end
betise [1d\]: hehe, i'd say the opposite :)
Koons [1k\]: :)
betise [1d\]: i think he fails to find obivious replys to his own moves
emerus [5k\]: it's not programmed to
Koons [1k\]: fun to watch.  see y'all
emerus [5k\]: it evaluates every reply to it and picks the move with the best result
betise [1d\]: but it loses points thinking the opposent will let his group die
emerus [5k\]: i'm sure it adds some heuristics to it
emerus [5k\]: but definitely had no feeling of natural moves hehe
])