(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50]TM[9000]OT[1x60 byo-yomi]
GN[European Go congress 2010 board 2  Round 5]PW[Csaba Mero]PB[Antti Tormanen]WR[6d]BR[6d]DT[2010-07-30]PC[The KGS Go Server at http://www.gokgs.com/]US[Liselot]C[Wagaboo [10k\]: is it here kang vs llya?
A1R [4k\]: if you read the players names then NO
Wagaboo [10k\]: sry T_T epic fail
HlFl [-\]: woot woot!
Bembelbote [-\]: Wagaboo, you'll be doomed for that fail!
Wagaboo [10k\]: nooooooooooo
Bembelbote [-\]: yes
Wagaboo [10k\]: noooooooooooooo
asd3: yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees
AhSayuni [4d\]: No Ali? :(
kt123 [3d\]: Antti ftw!!!
Wagaboo [10k\]: i bet on the first move :
Wagaboo [10k\]: R16
AhSayuni [4d\]: Who's Ali playing now?
Bembelbote [-\]: if you don't want to go to hell pls transfer 100k to following account of the holy chruch...
Bembelbote [-\]: :P
Wagaboo [10k\]: hu
AhSayuni [4d\]: huh? why is Ali playing a 5d?
MaxMakinen [2k\]: ahsayuni, why is who playing what?
AhSayuni [4d\]: Ali Jabarin
AhSayuni [4d\]: he was ranked 3rd after round 4
AhSayuni [4d\]: but he's matched up against a 3d!
MaxMakinen [2k\]: aah, there's a uneven number of people in that group, so he seems to have been paired one gruop below
AhSayuni [4d\]: (my mistake before)
Bembelbote [-\]: problably there are also other 5 dans with good results ;)
AhSayuni [4d\]: Kari Visala
asd3: lol so lucky
MaxMakinen [2k\]: and ahsayni, kari visala, has 4 wins, 0 losses, also beating a 5dan with the same gor rating as ali ;)
MaxMakinen [2k\]: so i wouldn't call him lucky ;)
AhSayuni [4d\]: oh.. yeah
AhSayuni [4d\]: ok, just saw that
AhSayuni [4d\]: does anyone here know him? (Visala)
EiNaRi [?\]: sure
AhSayuni [4d\]: oh.. he beat Fredrik
itepilah [1d\]: Go Csaba!
]
;B[dd]
;W[pp]C[Isobeutel [4k\]: how old is antti???
]
;B[qd]
;W[cp]
;B[ep]
;W[cn]
;B[qn]C[kt123 [3d\]: 20 or 21 i think
]
;W[nq]C[Isobeutel [4k\]: he seems much younger on the streem..
Wagaboo [10k\]: w can't see them
]
;B[kd]C[Wagaboo [10k\]: ca you zoom out?
vaudevil [4k\]: the names are the wrong way. antti is black
lalicoasa [3k\]: hei guys! antti is black! not csaba!
Isobeutel [4k\]: oh
RobSchley [7k\]: are these being broadcasted online or something?
Isobeutel [4k\]: yes, itts wrong
]
;W[qo]
;B[pn]
;W[pj]C[Isobeutel [4k\]: euro go the colours are switched!!!
holynec [?\]: yeah, mero is white...
]
;B[pg]
;W[nj]C[Shipper [3k\]: fixed
holynec [?\]: <LD
holynec [?\]: <:D
]
;B[mn]C[Isobeutel [4k\]: good
holynec [?\]: n6, o5, o6, p7
]
;W[no]C[holynec [?\]: p6
holynec [?\]: l4
Isobeutel [4k\]: fast playing...
HlFl [-\]: Antti camera shy?
AhSayuni [4d\]: N6 is slightly wrong shape I guess
HlFl [-\]: give us a look Antti!!
]
;B[nn]
;W[om]
;B[on]C[Weishenme [4d\]: go Csaba
ZeroKun [-\]: looks a bit like yesterdays game with taranu
Bembelbote [-\]: not a bit
Weishenme [4d\]: somebody knows the link for the broadcast please ? 
Acemi [?\]: f3 
Dagobert [3d\]: http://www.eurogotv.com/index.php?menu=Live&channel=EuroGoTV2
Isobeutel [4k\]: http://eurogotv.com/index.php?menu=Live&channel=EuroGoTV2
Bembelbote [-\]: look for eurogotv in google
Wagaboo [10k\]: g3
Weishenme [4d\]: thank you !!!!
]
;W[ng]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: too wide!?
holynec [?\]: m4
Excalibor [-\]: b m4 looks good but w p15 seems also big
Dagobert [3d\]: not too wide .. looks common
AhSayuni [4d\]: E4's a ladder breaker here :)
Bembelbote [-\]: maybe he wants to make quick sabaki to boshi on L6 or so
Dagobert [3d\]: liu xing often plays such fuseki
holynec [?\]: a little early to boshi hmm
Wagaboo [10k\]: p16?
]
;B[oi]C[Bembelbote [-\]: boshi with the intention of attacking E4 too :)
Wagaboo [10k\]: i'm bad in fuseki :(
holynec [?\]: you can attack e4 directly
AhSayuni [4d\]: this is what I meant with too wide...
typohh [6k\]: Im bad in fuseki too
typohh [6k\]: and midgame
Bembelbote [-\]: of course you can attack directly. but with the boshi in place the attack would be more severe as the right group would be attacked too
typohh [6k\]: and actually yose too
]
;W[ni]C[RobSchley [7k\]: what is boshi?
itepilah [1d\]: cap
]
;B[oj]
;W[ok]C[Acemi [?\]: the answer to this can be the fun part of the game if black likes fighting
]
;B[pi]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: maybe b should be statisfied if he connects undeneath
Acemi [?\]: honte :(
AhSayuni [4d\]: underneath*
Bembelbote [-\]: If whit would play a move on L6, so more or less on the head of N6, that is boshi
holynec [?\]: AhSayuni, how strong are you
AhSayuni [4d\]: I have a rank...
]
;W[nk]C[kukulis4 [2d\]: white receives heavy stones
kukulis4 [2d\]: may be
typohh [6k\]: b q9 big enough?
holynec [?\]: r9
AhSayuni [4d\]: r9 connects?
holynec [?\]: or does it disconnect?!
AhSayuni [4d\]: maybe not satisfactory after all
Wagaboo [10k\]: R10?
zypher [3k?\]: attacking at g3?
Wagaboo [10k\]: to get territory
gosonmu [5d?\]: white look nice
kukulis4 [2d\]: q9, white Q8 and black stones becomes separated in sente
AhSayuni [4d\]: though w's gain is not clear
Excalibor [-\]: maybe r10 q9 r9 but it looks doubtful
kukulis4 [2d\]: may be R9 better
AhSayuni [4d\]: r9 r8 s8 q8 s9 
AhSayuni [4d\]: I think
]
;B[qk]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: hmm
Excalibor [-\]: cool.. i wish i could read that well :-P
AhSayuni [4d\]: r8 q8 ?
gosonmu [5d?\]: R9 maybe right answer
kukulis4 [2d\]: may be white will not play R8
AhSayuni [4d\]: probably he won't
Acemi [?\]: break?
sagesse [-\]: r8 s8 ?
kukulis4 [2d\]: I expect white O16 or K10 now
kukulis4 [2d\]: something like that ..
RobSchley [7k\]: they just get up to take a break?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: yes
kukulis4 [2d\]: white L13 looks like a goo shape
kukulis4 [2d\]: good*
Bembelbote [-\]: w E3?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: pincer looks better no?
Shipper [3k\]: goo shape is very flexible
Renshuu02 [1k\]: for white like H3
Renshuu02 [1k\]: but
Renshuu02 [1k\]: O16 is more urgent
kukulis4 [2d\]: I would not leave white stones in center, except there is another big move, but I cant see it
Bembelbote [-\]: with C6 in place b can't finish the joseki with J3, so w would get this move. almost like pincering directly
Renshuu02 [1k\]: because white will fly without any base if black O16
Renshuu02 [1k\]: ok
kukulis4 [2d\]: white Q14 possible move
Renshuu02 [1k\]: and if whiote E3
Renshuu02 [1k\]: black C11
Renshuu02 [1k\]: or O16
Renshuu02 [1k\]: in order to let white on the 3rd line in the south
Renshuu02 [1k\]: ?
goodminton [-\]: first h4 to attack if b plays here first the advantage seems to big as b is connected right side
Renshuu02 [1k\]: E3 seems slower than 016 or C14 white
Bembelbote [-\]: mh, maybe your right
Renshuu02 [1k\]: we will see ^^
Renshuu02 [1k\]: they are sitting back
Bembelbote [-\]: but b seems to already have the advantage. so maybe something more drastoc then o16 or c14 is needed. Can't see a real gain for w there. 
Bembelbote [-\]: hehe, yeah :)
kukulis4 [2d\]: black leading, as he got real point in right side
kukulis4 [2d\]: points*
praeludium [5d\]: that's very good for black 
praeludium [5d\]: q13 is ideally placed
]
;W[ql]C[Bembelbote [-\]: what would be your next move as w, praeludium?
kukulis4 [2d\]: :)
AhSayuni [4d\]: hehe
Wagaboo [10k\]: r8?z 
Himura [1d\]: antti!!!!!
Wagaboo [10k\]: strange
AhSayuni [4d\]: thinking about Q8
]
;B[rl]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: but this seems simplest
kukulis4 [2d\]: you read this sequence before :)
zypher [3k?\]: s7
scurge [5d\]: this is better for white i think
AhSayuni [4d\]: so did he I guess :)
AhSayuni [4d\]: s7 q8
praeludium [5d\]: why scurge? I see black with territory, settled groups, good shape at p6 and w is unsetlled
mochi [3d?\]: s9
AhSayuni [4d\]: I think that w should tenuki to leave options
AhSayuni [4d\]: p16 looks possible
AhSayuni [4d\]: I think
scurge [5d\]: all moves white played were normal
scurge [5d\]: and i dont believe P10 and P11 a bit
Renshuu02 [1k\]: White player is almost diving into the game (litterally)
praeludium [5d\]: o13 is far from normal 
sagesse [-\]: q8 possible?
scurge [5d\]: its ok ;)
scurge [5d\]: positive :)
scurge [5d\]: maybe white could play something like K9 now.. but iam not sure
sagesse [-\]: or maybe influentially h4 ...)
kukulis4 [2d\]: what if white play R10 ?
kukulis4 [2d\]: or S9
praeludium [5d\]: p17? 
Nelsson [3k\]: K9 looks interesting, but why? Hoping for a cut at R8-area or preparing an attack towards e4? Does K9 influence approaches to D16?
avio [2d\]: w would like to cut q6 group. If he can't then tennuki
kukulis4 [2d\]: probably white cannot cut
avio [2d\]: he can cut but not prevent q6 making local eyes
Renshuu02 [1k\]: S7
Renshuu02 [1k\]: white
Renshuu02 [1k\]: where doest Black answer?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: does*
kukulis4 [2d\]: r7 ?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: yes
Nelsson [3k\]: K9 feels okay for extension from O10-stones, but is it also attacking move?
kukulis4 [2d\]: hm
Renshuu02 [1k\]: r7 Q8black?
kukulis4 [2d\]: white s7 looks playable
Renshuu02 [1k\]: black can kill 3 stones
Renshuu02 [1k\]: and he got a opening on the corner
Renshuu02 [1k\]: but
scurge [5d\]: White should seriously consider tenuki, i feel its not the time to settle the shapes yet
Renshuu02 [1k\]: black would be cut ( and alive)
Renshuu02 [1k\]: if white tenuki and black connect
Renshuu02 [1k\]: wouldn't white be behind?
kukulis4 [2d\]: white s7, r7, q8, s6, s9, t7, r10
Drarego [7k\]: r 10
Gizensha [?\]: s7 r7 q8 s10 ?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: and white would cut black
kukulis4 [2d\]: if white R10 now, then black q9
Renshuu02 [1k\]: which ws the purpose of his R8
Brown [1d\]:  
]
;W[rm]
;B[qm]C[jwc [-\]: q8  r7 q7 s9 s10 t8 q9 
]
;W[pl]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: oh?
]
;B[rn]
;W[rk]
;B[sm]
;W[qj]C[Renshuu02 [1k\]: ^^
Gizensha [?\]: hmm
]
;B[od]C[kukulis4 [2d\]: white got a good result
AhSayuni [4d\]: strange Antti
AhSayuni [4d\]: what was wrong with Q8?
Weishenme [4d\]: I think the result is balanced
kukulis4 [2d\]: white has sente now
Renshuu02 [1k\]: now white can pincer and attack N6
AhSayuni [4d\]: can't really attack n6
cherisse [1k\]: is antii a player on kgs too?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: just the pincer isn't enough?
AhSayuni [4d\]: need s5 first
kukulis4 [2d\]: white sente and strong group in center
typohh [6k\]: Antti playes as Tien on kgs.
]
;W[ro]C[kukulis4 [2d\]: I think nobody will have points in center
cherisse [1k\]: oh
AhSayuni [4d\]: p4 looks useful
Renshuu02 [1k\]: in order to turn around of O5 and create something on the south?
]
;B[ml]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: strange move!
kukulis4 [2d\]: n8 
kukulis4 [2d\]: looks slow
kukulis4 [2d\]: s5 was also slow, but thick move, and N8 looks weird
Renshuu02 [1k\]: if white add a move in the center or the east to be alive
Renshuu02 [1k\]: black could create something on the south
Renshuu02 [1k\]: like
Renshuu02 [1k\]: M4?
Kanin [-\]: I think H4
typohh [6k\]: weird how b didnt even think very long about playing the n8 move
Loons [3k\]: He's probably been eying it up
kukulis4 [2d\]: well ... white will have no point in center for sure after black N8
Gizensha [?\]: now if w settles both groups what is the use of n6 group?
AhSayuni [4d\]: maybe just stragely afraid of w buiding something there..
MaxMakinen [2k\]: either that or black is just simply playing too fast :D
AhSayuni [4d\]: strangely*
stf7 [1k\]: players left ^^
kukulis4 [2d\]: both ?
Gizensha [?\]: wnet for e beer together? :)
kukulis4 [2d\]: :D
Renshuu02 [1k\]: that move seems to you useless?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: doesn t it
Renshuu02 [1k\]: scare white for life
kukulis4 [2d\]: it is not useless, just looks slow
Renshuu02 [1k\]: help black to live
Renshuu02 [1k\]: and prepare the south?
kukulis4 [2d\]: white live easily with s12
Renshuu02 [1k\]: yeah
Renshuu02 [1k\]: but he needs to play it now
Renshuu02 [1k\]: or around the center
Renshuu02 [1k\]: which let black the opportunity to do somehting on the south
Renshuu02 [1k\]: no?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: white would end up
kukulis4 [2d\]: I cant see so far :)
Gizensha [?\]: oh! i'we been looking at this wrong...
Renshuu02 [1k\]: with poor territory
kvartaali [?\]: woah.. that was like in the movies.. zooming and stuff
Gizensha [?\]: maybe i should stay silent for a while
kvartaali [?\]: :)
Renshuu02 [1k\]: i can't read that too
zypher [3k?\]: g4
Renshuu02 [1k\]: cause after white protects the center group
Renshuu02 [1k\]: i can't find a good move for black
]
;W[kj]C[Renshuu02 [1k\]: to create a south
Renshuu02 [1k\]: show me the way antti
Renshuu02 [1k\]: H4 seems wrong
Renshuu02 [1k\]: because white could cut
Renshuu02 [1k\]: and attack both groups
Renshuu02 [1k\]: M4 could be cut
Renshuu02 [1k\]: M5 would be slow
Renshuu02 [1k\]: ( am i flooding?)
typohh [6k\]: noone answers because everyoen has u censored for flooding.
kukulis4 [2d\]: yeah :)
kukulis4 [2d\]: lol
Renshuu02 [1k\]: ^^
AhSayuni [4d\]: m4?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: seems good
MaxMakinen [2k\]: aah, they're back at the board now :D
holynec [?\]: this kid is young
typohh [6k\]: what does it say on his fan?
Isobeutel [4k\]: so told me he is 20 or so...
Kanin [-\]: he just looks like a kid
Isobeutel [4k\]: yes
MaxMakinen [2k\]: he's 22 or something like that
Isobeutel [4k\]: he looks like 15 0r 16
]
;B[jl]C[cherisse [1k\]: antti is like one of those beautiful guys in animy
zife [6k\]: I thought he was 20 or so
MaxMakinen [2k\]: 20-something, who cares :D
holynec [?\]: wierd move
holynec [?\]: -.-
Renshuu02 [1k\]: ...his strategy is obscur to me
kvartaali [?\]: maybe just trying to make enough eyespace and then leave it there or something
cherisse [1k\]: first, you are 1k. second, what is obscur?
typohh [6k\]: how come w doesnt pincer the e4 stone?
sfssdf: just imagine a move o nthe lower board and check out the variations if white pincers
sfssdf: this move looks good in that situation
Renshuu02 [1k\]: the final move
Shiona [?\]: I can't see the stream
Renshuu02 [1k\]: seems to say
Renshuu02 [1k\]: try to invade the south
Renshuu02 [1k\]: but a simple extension seems enough
scurge [5d\]: i would have been happier if all sequence on right wasnt played
Renshuu02 [1k\]: i m probably wrong ( and i know i m just 1k kgs, no need to remind me)
]
;W[fc]
;B[ec]
;W[fd]
;B[df]
;W[ic]
;B[kb]
;W[ij]C[Renshuu02 [1k\]: (i exceeded the limit of sentences during a game, i will stay quiet now, enjoy the game, bye)
]
;B[ie]C[kvartaali [?\]: good luck with that
]
;W[ff]
;B[dh]C[typohh [6k\]: j15 looks like a very good move
]
;W[je]
;B[jd]
;W[id]C[cherisse [1k\]: cool shirt
scurge [5d\]: J10 was pretty key
]
;B[if]
;W[ke]
;B[le]
;W[kf]C[Shiona [?\]: does the web stream work for you guys?
Gizensha [?\]: yes
Shiona [?\]: I just get a black square
falloutti [1d?\]: too slow internet?
Shiona [?\]: "transferring data from cdngw.ustream.tv", no picture
]
;B[lf]
;W[kg]C[Shiona [?\]: should be fast enough
falloutti [1d?\]: tried refreshing few times?
falloutti [1d?\]: or a different browser =)
Shiona [?\]: yea, next step would be to dl some other browser
falloutti [1d?\]: should work just fine
]
;B[mq]C[kvartaali [?\]: huh..
RobSchley [7k\]: that's different
Shiona [?\]: just to be sure, could you give me the URI 
kukulis4 [2d\]: I would pus h one more time at M13
RobSchley [7k\]: antti seems so calm and relaxed
RobSchley [7k\]: just chillin with his fan
kvartaali [?\]: imo that's just the fin mentality :P
]
;W[mp]
;B[lq]
;W[lp]C[kvartaali [?\]: is this good for b or white?.. I mean b could end up running with the center group again
kvartaali [?\]: but can w benefit from the running anymore
typohh [6k\]: what choices does b have here? k3 and l3?
typohh [6k\]: j3 maybe?
falloutti [1d?\]: O2 for one
falloutti [1d?\]: P3 maybe
learnlife [19k\]: Um, how to find the video streaming
learnlife [19k\]: ?
kvartaali [?\]: you can check EuroGoTV2:s info
kvartaali [?\]: or just google eurogotc
kvartaali [?\]: eurogotv
learnlife [19k\]: thanks!
typohh [6k\]: so anyone watching the stream managed what is reads on antti's fan?
Eilinen [-\]: http://eurogotv.com/index.php?menu=Live&channel=EuroGoTV2
Shiona [?\]: doesn't work with firefox, IE or chrome...
Shiona [?\]: I guess I'll give up
Suvi [1d\]: works fine
Eilinen [-\]: hm i had same problem yesterday
Gizensha [?\]: typohh: "Fried chicken 5€"
Eilinen [-\]: but today it works
kvartaali [?\]: maybe you have some problems with firewall
Shiona [?\]: maybe a user limit?
Suvi [1d\]: mää just loggasin niin tuskin
zife [6k\]: ustream user limit is 30k I believe
typohh [6k\]: gizensha, it would be funny if it actually read that
Gizensha [?\]: i had problems with the stream the other day
Kanin [-\]: I don't think they allow ustream in china :(
Shiona [?\]: I dont really believe in a firewall problem
zife [6k\]: I'm guessing cookies
Shiona [?\]: the server should have no reason to connect to my end
zife [6k\]: firewall shouldn't be a problem with ustream
kvartaali [?\]: well if he has a message stating that waiting for incoming data or something then there's something blocking the data
kvartaali [?\]: or there's a problem with sender, though I'm watching it myself
zife [6k\]: since it doesn't work with any browser, it might be flash player bugging
Shiona [?\]: it seems none of the ustream streams work for me
zife [6k\]: try removing ustream cookies from flash player settings
zife [6k\]: maybe that'll help
zife [6k\]: flash player settings are on macromedia's website btw
]
;B[oq]
;W[nr]
;B[op]C[Kanin [-\]: p3 looks like a joke
mikan [1d?\]: Finn good at bad jokes
Kanin [-\]: w just q3 now
zypher [3k?\]: looking for big invasion 
]
;W[pq]
;B[oo]C[shrike [3k\]: wasn't p3 a bit easy on b
shrike [3k\]: q3 sorry
mihi [6d\]: what else?
shrike [3k\]: what is wrong with p5
mihi [6d\]: P5,Q3
mihi [6d\]: P5,Q3,R3,Q5,R4,O4
mihi [6d\]: or P5,Q3,Q5,R3
shrike [3k\]: i was thinking to sacrifice the two w stones on the right
shrike [3k\]: r5s5
shrike [3k\]: en get sente to play k3
mihi [6d\]: yes but black won't play Q5 
shrike [3k\]: ah oke..
maligo [-\]: is this really good for black?
Excalibor [-\]: mmm
kvartaali [?\]: w corner looks a bit cramped so it must be :)
ekku [-\]: where are the players ?:)
Gizensha [?\]: having a beer again
Gizensha [?\]: finnish club style of playing
]
;W[or]
;B[kq]C[ekku [-\]: so this is a bonus tournament after all :D
]
;W[kp]
;B[jq]C[Gizensha [?\]: you are supposed to drink while playing anyway so no reason to give points for it ;p
]
;W[np]C[mihi [6d\]: L6 better than O4?
]
;B[jn]C[maligo [-\]: really=
maligo [-\]: ?
]
;W[ip]C[mihi [6d\]: yes,because b didn't have 2 eyes and had to defend with L7 or something
mihi [6d\]: now just cut and H5 
kimball [4d?\]: if w does not defend o4 the cut leaves bad aji in the corner i think
Koukkaaja [3d\]: this was a poker move
]
;B[iq]
;W[in]C[huggy [2k\]: who is the guy in the back?
Effem [3k\]: wow whata pacey game
]
;B[im]
;W[kn]
;B[km]
;W[jo]C[typohh [6k\]: last w move looks like its gote..
]
;B[gq]C[kvartaali [?\]: http://www.egc2010.fi/professionals.php
TonyTiger [4d\]: don't underestimate gote
typohh [6k\]: w f12 isnt big enough to be played?
]
;W[jm]C[Shiona [?\]: what about c9?
]
;B[kl]
;W[qc]C[kvartaali [?\]: b still open on the upper left
typohh [6k\]: would b f18 (not right now) be a bad way for b to seal upper left?
Eilinen [-\]: How much they have time?
typohh [6k\]: I bet after thinking this long he playes the obvious move q17
yamashitaK [5d\]: s16
]
;B[pd]C[kvartaali [?\]: hmm..
mihi [6d\]: S14 now
mihi [6d\]: or C17
kuruhuru9 [6k\]: эй
]
;W[pb]
;B[ob]
;W[rd]
;B[rb]C[Ukasuhs [1d\]: i think s18 instead of s16 lived in the corner
shaula [1k\]: white R14?
]
;W[rc]
;B[re]C[avio [2d\]: w s18 dies
Ukasuhs [1d\]: how
Ukasuhs [1d\]: s18 r19 s16
avio [2d\]: because w q17 do not force b p17
]
;W[sb]
;B[ra]C[avio [2d\]: s18 bs16
typohh [6k\]: nice tsumego they have going on there
avio [2d\]: I guess this way w dies
Renshuu02 [1k\]: yeah
Renshuu02 [1k\]: Q19 T16 seem miai
Gizensha [?\]: so now w seeks a way to use this from outside?
Renshuu02 [1k\]: maybe there is a thing with 17
Renshuu02 [1k\]: if Q17
Renshuu02 [1k\]: R18
]
;W[nb]C[Renshuu02 [1k\]: calls T16
typohh [6k\]: I dont get it, if w rly dies here, how come he didntp lay s14 instead of s17?
Eilinen [-\]: How much they have time?
avio [2d\]: this o18 may be the answer?
VickyH [2d\]: p17 p19 t16 
avio [2d\]: after t16 w n17 or something there?
Ukasuhs [1d\]: p19 q19 q17 ?
Ukasuhs [1d\]: oh nvm
courgete [20k?\]: o17?
]
;B[oa]C[Brown [1d\]: aiming on a m16 cut?
MilanMilan [9d\]: ...
Luna86 [9k\]: Milan, w dead?
yamashitaK [5d\]: q19...
AhSayuni [4d\]: q19 q17 
yamashitaK [5d\]: why no p17 for b 
Ibicus [1k\]: o17
Koukkaaja [3d\]: it seemed p17 worked
Ibicus [1k\]: then m16
AhSayuni [4d\]: I guess cause it makes p19 sente
Wagaboo [10k\]: white dead
Luna86 [9k\]: p17 q17 ?
slim76 [2d\]: o17 p17 m16
deft [4d\]: W lives
Zairex [1k\]: seki
yamashitaK [5d\]: p17 
AhSayuni [4d\]: seems right..
Ukasuhs [1d\]: but what after p17?
deft [4d\]: W can play R18 and it seems B cannot play T16 in response because of P17 tactic
Ukasuhs [1d\]: how does w end up living
Ukasuhs [1d\]: deft, how can w punsih b if he does play t16 in that situation. i dont see it
typohh [6k\]: r18 t16 p17 o17 q17 n18?
typohh [6k\]: I dont get it
Ukasuhs [1d\]: ya, even though theres 3+ cuts for white, i dont see any of them working
AhSayuni [4d\]: p17 seems like the only way to me
AhSayuni [4d\]: interesting problem
Veivi [4d\]: looks like P17 simply works
deft [4d\]: actually W has to start with P17, starting with R18 isn't good
maligo [-\]: p17 o17 
CreazyJ [3d\]: R14?
Ibicus [1k\]: why not o17 and m16 this cut will hurt black
AhSayuni [4d\]: p17 o17 q17 n18 q19 o19 t16 
AhSayuni [4d\]: thousand year ko
]
;W[ld]C[deft [4d\]: P17 O17 Q17 N18 Q19 O19 T16
typohh [6k\]: why o17? why not q17?
AhSayuni [4d\]: q17 p17 t16 q19 
deft [4d\]: P17 Q17 R18 O17 T16 is good for W
Ukasuhs [1d\]: deft, theres still t19 ko after that
Koukkaaja [3d\]: how big is this fish
typohh [6k\]: thx
deft [4d\]: T19 ko is thousand year
Ukasuhs [1d\]: but ya, i suppose he could live that way
Ukasuhs [1d\]: oh and its ko for seki anyway isnt it
avio [2d\]: w q19 now
avio [2d\]: why not q 19?
]
;B[md]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: thousand year ko can last that long if someone is trying to kill
Veivi [4d\]: if q19 q17 and w dead...
AhSayuni [4d\]: p17 still possible
deft [4d\]: P17 is only way to live for W, but it looks like W is more concerned with tying his two center groups together
Wagaboo [10k\]: p17 is about 12 points no?
AhSayuni [4d\]: isn't something around f12 better for that purpose?
AhSayuni [4d\]: g11 perhaps
typohh [6k\]: p17 is 23 points by my count
]
;W[lc]C[AhSayuni [4d\]: I don't think it's so important anyway
]
;B[kc]C[MaxMakinen [2k\]: if this works for black then this invasion has been more or less a disaster for whiet?
MaxMakinen [2k\]: *white
Zairex [1k\]: even if l17 dies it might give black more forcing moves than letting white play l17
markpi: looks like w misread and tries to press something out in sente
universal [2d\]: m18
dd33:  w will win
DanielTom [5d\]: yes
EuroGoTV2 [-\]: Live TV broadcast of this game on http://eurogotv.com/index.php?menu=Live&channel=EuroGoTV2
universal [2d\]: b dead at top
CreazyJ [3d\]: m18, m19?
universal [2d\]: connect
]
;W[oc]
;B[nc]
;W[pc]
;B[mb]
;W[pa]
;B[na]
;W[sd]C[avio [2d\]: ko?
Wagaboo [10k\]: ko
universal [2d\]: s14
Zairex [1k\]: g15
universal [2d\]: b needs t15
universal [2d\]: for seki
]
;B[fb]
;W[gb]
;B[eb]
;W[ne]C[universal [2d\]: i doubt that move
universal [2d\]: is biggest
asssaa: s14  for w
universal [2d\]: peep is good
]
;B[nd]
;W[cj]C[juhop [1d?\]: if w s14, r15 t15 s13 works for b?
]
;B[dj]
;W[dk]
;B[ej]
;W[ci]C[Brown [1d\]: w seems good
]
;B[ch]
;W[hg]
;B[cq]
;W[bq]
;B[dq]
;W[br]C[Gizensha [?\]: b seems to be behind
Djaian [-\]: still some ko aji in the T19-corner for black, but white seems ahead
]
;B[bh]
;W[hm]
;B[lk]
;W[sk]
;B[il]
;W[gp]C[Luna86 [9k\]: isn't that i tad risky
Luna86 [9k\]: for b
petri [4k\]: what is risky?
]
;B[fq]C[typohh [6k\]: he is refering to not answering t9 I guess
Luna86 [9k\]: ye
]
;W[ln]
;B[lm]
;W[nm]C[petri [4k\]: Well Answering moves like that ans folowing opponent around woudl guarantee loss
typohh [6k\]: b o8
]
;B[nl]C[Luna86 [9k\]: well, maybe but where will black summons 2nd eye now?
]
;W[so]
;B[hl]C[TonyTiger [4d\]: white got huge endgame
]
;W[gm]C[deft [4d\]: W looks in control
]
;B[gl]C[petri [4k\]: Luan
EuroGoTV2 [-\]: Live TV broadcast of this game on http://eurogotv.com/index.php?menu=Live&channel=EuroGoTV2
petri [4k\]: Luna. Form B point of view accepting 1 pt loss is no different from 100 pt loss
Fredegas [4d\]: white is winning
petri [4k\]: And by quite a lot I guess
Fredegas [4d\]: yes
Fredegas [4d\]: even simple endgame is sufficient
EuroGoTV2 [-\]: m13
typohh [6k\]: w f9 and some 9d magic to kill b?
]
;W[fk]C[petri [4k\]: Not gonna work but will gain in the endgame as well
]
;B[hj]
;W[hi]C[typohh [6k\]: SE found a way to kill the black dragon, so now all w has to do is find the way.
]
;B[ek]C[petri [4k\]: SE :) I hope that was sarcasm
]
;W[fl]
;B[gj]
;W[dl]
;B[lg]C[Ramppu [1d\]: is M14 possible?
snowman [-\]: you do know that that is kato masao folding fan antti has
Ramppu [1d\]: heh
]
;W[kh]C[Djaian [-\]: black must add a move around F11 somehow
Weishenme [4d\]: W R14 big
Djaian [-\]: W R14 is risky, because if black strenghten himself there, the ko at T19 might start
]
;B[mh]C[Zairex [1k\]: ko for seki only
Zairex [1k\]: oh
Zairex [1k\]: i guess not only for seki
]
;W[nh]C[Djaian [-\]: after D8, the D11 cut looks dangerous, black shoud really add a move there.
Zitrone [1k\]: s11
Zairex [1k\]: m11
]
;B[ri]C[Zitrone [1k\]: ^^
Djaian [-\]: black is thinking about T19 ko
]
;W[qi]C[Zitrone [1k\]: black just take a big point before connecting
TonyTiger [4d\]: the only move...
Djaian [-\]: I think white is in control of the game anyway.
Ramppu [1d\]: is T19 doomed for white?
Weishenme [4d\]: M16 and M17 are very useful
]
;B[qh]
;W[ph]
;B[oh]
;W[og]C[Nhane [2k\]: why is black hesitating ? If he did this sequence, he look at it before no ?
Ramppu [1d\]: maybe he is taking a leak
vaudevil [4k\]: under the desk?
Ramppu [1d\]: i think there are bathrooms in the congress
]
;B[ph]C[Inw [1d\]: s12 
TonyTiger [4d\]: S12 no good, it's bad :)
Inw [1d\]:    :D
Zitrone [1k\]: q14 better
TonyTiger [4d\]: yeah. a lot of better :)
Nhane [2k\]: White is probably looking for something at s14... no ?
Agricul: or r14
Ramppu [1d\]: is w right corner dead?
TonyTiger [4d\]: no
Weishenme [4d\]: q14also interesting
]
;W[lh]C[Ramppu [1d\]: why b just dont wait untill the game ends and then beging the ko?
Teppo86: lol w wont allow that
Teppo86: he would take seki
Ramppu [1d\]: what can w do to prevent?
Teppo86: r18 eg?
]
;B[me]C[Ramppu [1d\]: oh yes
Ramppu [1d\]: how very blind of me
Nhane [2k\]: I can't read the seki >< S14 doesn't make it live with one more liberty ?
Teppo86: s14 doesnt give liberty
]
;W[lj]C[Zitrone [1k\]: t19 r18 t17 make a 2 step ko no?
]
;B[gi]C[snowman [-\]: it's an awfully slow thousand-year-ko
Zitrone [1k\]: yop, but it's a ko, if black want to try he can
]
;W[rf]C[petri [4k\]: But if B does not fight it thne he has lost already?
snowman [-\]: he needs four moves to even start the ko
]
;B[qf]
;W[se]
;B[qe]
;W[rg]
;B[rh]
;W[sf]C[TonyTiger [4d\]: nice reduction by white
DanielTom [5d\]: W is ahead by... 20 points?
typohh [6k\]: the ko is worth alot more now
TonyTiger [4d\]: T14 big enough???
Nhane [2k\]: A reduction for a ko... funny
petri [4k\]: assuming you winb without giving something in return
Zairex [1k\]: no ko anymore
]
;B[hh]C[Nhane [2k\]: Living group indeed
typohh [6k\]: its a 4 step ko?
MaxMakinen [2k\]: eurogotv2, how much time do the players have left?
Weishenme [4d\]: J12
]
;W[ig]C[Teppo86: no ko anymore
]
;B[ak]
;W[bk]
;B[aj]
;W[al]C[typohh [6k\]: ohright, 1 outside liberty too much
]
;B[bi]
;W[bj]
;B[ai]
;W[bl]
;B[hb]
;W[gc]
;B[ib]
;W[ha]
;B[ia]
;W[ga]
;B[cr]
;W[hc]
;B[jb]
;W[ee]
;B[de]C[Nhane [2k\]: bigger than the monkey slide ? Oo'
]
;W[ls]
;B[ks]C[Peritoine [1d?\]: this is not goté
Nhane [2k\]: I talked about E15-D15
]
;W[ii]C[Nhane [2k\]: But I think I saw wath it is
]
;B[gg]
;W[gf]
;B[fg]
;W[hq]
;B[hr]
;W[hp]
;B[do]C[hirakawade [2d?\]: White = +10 points
]
;W[co]
;B[bs]
;W[mr]C[slim76 [2d\]: less than 10
]
;B[lr]
;W[ms]C[Luna86 [9k\]: a2?
]
;B[jr]C[Nhane [2k\]: Black has to protect 
]
;W[ef]
;B[eg]C[Ramppu [1d\]: f5?
]
;W[mg]
;B[fn]
;W[fm]
;B[ar]
;W[bp]
;B[dn]C[LGLifeGood [1k\]: d6 gote ?
]
;W[ih]
;B[dm]
;W[cm]
;B[gh]
;W[fa]
;B[ea]
;W[fo]
;B[en]
;W[gn]C[slim76 [2d\]: p14
Fredegas [4d\]: I think, white will win by little
Luna86 [9k\]: by komi or so
Nhane [2k\]: I tried to play a quick end. W+5.5 Close... but probably enough
Teppo86: i think  b wins by 2,5
Zairex [1k\]: s10
]
;B[fp]C[Zairex [1k\]: hmm not good
Zairex [1k\]: s10 that is
]
;W[mk]
;B[ol]C[Zitrone [1k\]: yes s10 is gote
]
;W[pm]C[Nhane [2k\]: s 10 for black is two point gote or 1 point sente
]
;B[kk]
;W[fj]
;B[fi]
;W[di]
;B[ei]
;W[oe]C[avio [2d\]: w+5
]
;B[mo]
;W[lo]C[VickyH [2d\]: w+9,5
Gizensha [?\]: 7,5 ;)
]
;B[po]C[Gizensha [?\]: hmm
erikk [-\]: looks very close
]
;W[pk]
;B[mm]
;W[rj]C[Partiellgo [1k\]: white is leading
Gizensha [?\]: w wins. the question is by how much 
Partiellgo [1k\]: with komi
avio [2d\]: i've checked again: w+5
Weishenme [4d\]: w has to add 3 moves in upper right corner
]
;B[sn]
;W[qp]
;B[sl]C[Weishenme [4d\]: haveyou counted that ?
avio [2d\]: i did
]
;W[ik]
;B[jk]
;W[jj]
;B[cs]
;W[aq]
;B[as]
;W[jn]
;B[eo]
;W[go]
;B[ed]
;W[qb]C[crazyboy [5d\]: w+5.5
]
;B[qg]
;W[qa]
;B[sh]C[Nhane [2k\]: w+4.5
]
;W[sa]C[Hellhuman [1d\]: 5d counting himself, 2k asking se :)
crazyboy [5d\]: i assume komi=7.5
Suvi [1d\]: 6.5
Weishenme [4d\]: bravo Csaba !!!!
Nhane [2k\]: XD okay okay, probably 5,5... I can try :p
Gizensha [?\]: 4,5
Suvi [1d\]: i meant 6.5 komi
EuroGoTV2 [-\]: B+4.5
slim76 [2d\]: B?
ExplO [2d\]: if komi is 7,5, it cannot be w+5,5
Gizensha [?\]: b?
EuroGoTV2 [-\]: W+4.5
Nhane [2k\]: :p 
slim76 [2d\]: haha
Suvi [1d\]: aww
avio [2d\]: komi is 6,5
MaxMakinen [2k\]: sigh :(
])